Ww2 medals

[seanmac]

Thanks again Doc, yes apart from the air sea rescue trawler Robert Hastie MOWT attached to north Atlantic ops, sailed in many convoys. Ship Dolabella convoy on275, hx338, Jw65, ra66, on305. ship Empire Spearhead transferred back to ops July 44 pouch papers too faded to read convoy numbers. ASA Lothrop on loan from US Greenock to Chatham no info ,Colworth Force costal convoys fbc64, etc64, ebc100, Saint Enoch ur111, wn560, ru112, etc70 ship lost on convoy U BOAT. Survivors picked up by hospital ship 65 RMS Duke Of Argyll. another convoy no for this is etc27 but i think the latter is right. That means my Dad would be entitled to among others the Atlantic Star, Artic Medal, France and German Star and the Russian Artic Medal claimed at the Russian Embassy i believe . I think that should be enough to deserve a medal. Why is it so hard to claim a medal for a Merchant Navy Seaman.

[seanmac]

Hi Brenda, some of the convoy numbers are on #28, the rescue ship /trawler was the Robert Hastie, she was stationed in Killybegs county Donegal thought the second world war and crewed by British merchant seamen on ops from Londonderry It is extremely difficult to trace her movements as it was a special arrangement between the British and Irish governments. She was armed with 2 machine guns, but the crew had to wear civvies in port. Many ships and planes were lost along the Donegal /Derry /Sligo coast during the war and that was why she was stationed in Killybegs in Eire.

[Hugh]

Hi, applying for medals is not always straightforward so you need to understand the requirements of the medal office and how they will react to your application. The first thing is we need to know what actual records you have in your possession because not all of them will be acceptable as evidence of service. If the evidence is not acceptable then you will not get his medals.

If there is no medal entitlement for him held in BT 395 at Kew, this is due to the fact that his medals were either never claimed by him or his next of kin. It could also mean that the Registry of Shipping & Seamen at Cardiff no longer have note of his medal file as it has not survived. So, in this case, the onus is on his next of kin to apply for his medals but importantly as well as filling in the application form you will also have to supply a copy of his death certificate and proof of his sea service during the war. This proof comes in a few forms but the easiest and indeed best is to supply a copy of his discharge books. Problem is, many families no longer have these books so you will need to access his records from archived sources.

Acceptable records in lieu of his discharge books would be a copy of his CRS 10 and movement cards of the ships recorded there. Note the CRS 10 doesn’t include ships from 1939 and 1940 as it begins in January 1941. In that case you may have a CR2 card within his seaman’s pouch, which may give this information, which is another file you should get to make this process a lot smoother.

I note you have a list of ships and convoys so the first question is how do you know about those ships? Do you in fact have his discharge books? If so, great, the process is reasonably straightforward. If not then you need to acquire the documents listed above.

Of course, the other problem is the delays now being encountered due to the pandemic. Any questions please feel free.

Regards
Hugh

[seanmac]

Thanks Hugh, I have his seaman's pouch and done some recherch . I just have some notes now as i lost all my files etc. when my old laptop crashed

[Brenda Shackleton]

Hello Seamac,

It's possible to apply for the Arctic Star via Cardiff with a Death Certificate.
Russian Medal from the Russian Embassy ? Forget it ! They only handed them out to living Survivors...
My Dad rescued the entire crew of the Russian Ship STALINGRAD on 13th September 1942 on PQ18. 87 Russians were safely disembarked at Krasnaya Quay, Archangel . Nothing for that !
JW Convoys replaced the PQ series . JW65 UK to North Russia
RA Convoys replaced the QP series. RA66 North Russia to UK.

ON = UK to North America
HX = Halifax to UK

Cardiff are very helpful. There's a link somewhere on this site on how to apply.
Best of luck
Brenda

============================
Below from Family History - Royal Navy and Naval History.Net

MARCH 1945

As Russian convoy JW65 approached Kola Inlet with 24 merchant ships on the 20th, waiting U-boats sank two and "U-716" sank sloop "LAPWING" of the escort. Return RA65 set out on the 23rd and all 25 ships got through to the Orkney Islands on the last day of the month.

APRIL 1945

29th - Russia/UK Convoy RA66, the Last Convoy Battle of the War - Kola Inlet bound convoy JW66 (22 ships) arrived safely on the 25th with escort carriers "Premier" and "Vindex", cruiser "Diadem", Home Fleet destroyers and the 8th and 19th EGs all under the command of Rear-Adm A. E. Cunninghame-Graham.
Return convoy RA66 (24 ships) set out on the 29th with JW66s escort, some of which went ahead to clear the 14 U-boats waiting off the Inlet. Frigates "Anguilla", "Cotton", "Loch lnsh" and "Loch Shin" of the 19th EG accounted for "U-307" followed by "U-286", the last U-boats sunk by warships of the Royal Navy. In the action, frigate "GOODALL" of the 19th EG was torpedoed by "U-968" and went down with heavy loss of life. She was the last major warship of the Royal and Dominion Navies lost in the war against Germany.
RA66 arrived safely in the Clyde on 8th May

[Brenda Shackleton]

Hello John Gill
Read all these posts. Did you ever get the medals that you wanted ?
Brenda
PS Have a photo of you and Terry at Jim's Funeral. May 2019

[j.sabourn]

#26 “ why is it so hard for Merchant Seamen to claim a medal ? “ probably because most merchant seamen couldn’t care less. If they do it is to leave as a memory to someone else . They sometimes sell when hard up if the medal is of any value . Living among a lot of ex servicemen , every rememberence day or Anzac Day etc. at the services some are walking around with a definite port list. I have yet to see someone name them all for what they were for, and as I know some were never in a war zone I dont embarass them and ask. Has anyone asked how Prince Harry is now sporting 4 when a few months ago it was 3 ? I know he was in Afghanistan so will have a Campaign medal which everyone got , to itemise the medals that senior officers sport and going on their ages and length
Of service they must have got one every 6 months at least. Years ago it used to be not the done thing to show more than 3 medals at one time, today we live in a peacock world. Everyone to their own thing however. We live in a free society. Cheers JS

Put on some post a long time ago , Winston Churchill House of Commons March 1944.....The object of presenting medals, stars, and ribbons is to give pride and pleasure to those who have deserved them.
Just about covers everything .

JS

[Rod Seville]

Hi John, I had a similar problem with Army records and found out there were certain qualifying dates for medals so if your Father's dates fall outside those set by the Government then your father wont be entitled to a medal. Unfair I know but they set the rules. You need to find out it there were qualifying dates and if your fathers dates are outside the date range then the pouch would register as empty. I find this grossly unfair where a relative has participated in a campaign and they are not given the entitlement when they risked their life for their country. Rod

[Audrey Young]

Hello, can anyone tell me what the annotation over the top of my uncle's medal record means please? He was Ralph Frederick Smith from Tynemouth and served in the Merchant Navy from August 1935 until he was lost at sea when the Empire Dryden was torpedoed in April 1942. Part of his service was on the Aurenia which was commissioned into the Royal Navy in August 1939. It was an escort ship on the Northern Patrol but MoD didn't think that would qualify him for the Arctic Star. I wonder what the scrawl over his medal record means, in particular the words 'Prize money involved'? Now I'll try to attach the record...

RFS Medal Record.jpg

From what i can make out , looks like there are no markings for Medals on his name , however as it is very badly Printed , who knows.
Think that Hugh gave all info that may be appropriate on this so far!
Possibly if you got a better copy somewhere???
I notice at the NA that a pouch on him says Empty ??? Wonder why!??
Good Hunting

[Hugh]

I am afraid I cannot make it out but as he served as Naval Aux Personnel (NAP) in the beginning of the war on a T124X agreement. He retained his MN pay and conditions but was subject to Naval discipline - effectively part of the RN.
So the issuing authority for his medals was the Admiralty not the MN. DNA = Director Naval Accounts.
The RN paid out prize money to personnel over many centuries.

"It was announced yesterday by the First Lord of the Admiralty that, in conformity with long tradition, prize money will once more be paid to the Royal Navy in respect of enemy ships and cargoes captured during the war. It has been decided, however, that this is the last occasion on which prize money will be paid. Source The Times 20th December 1945."

Prize money would be distributed as a share to all not just to the ship's directly involved. The RAF also received a proportion of the Naval Prize for WW2, I believe, but I cannot be sure.

To be awarded the Arctic Star he would have to have served North of the Arctic Circle. The qualifying area is defined as 66° 32’ North.

Regards
Hugh