My Grandfathers History

[steve elliott]

Hello im new to this forum but I am trying to find out some information about my Grandfather and the ships he sailed on during World War 2. My Dad tells me he was in the Royal Artillery attached to the Merchant Navy as a gunner onboard ships.

I know he served on MV King Edgar from these papers I have

also I have this as well

and the other side


I cant seem to find much about the King Edgar other than she was sank by a U Boat on the 2 March 1945, woudl anyone be able to help with soem direction as to how I might find out more about my Grandfather wartime service and ships he served aboard.

Many thanks
Steve

[Keith at Tregenna]

At 18.12 hours on 2 Mar, 1945, U-1302 attacked the convoy SC-167 in the St. George´s Channel and sank the King Edgar and Novasli. The U-boat could not report her attack, because she was lost five days later.

The King Edgar (Master Arthur Warren Wheeler) was taken in tow, but sank later. Two crew members and two gunners were lost. The master, 32 crew members and nine gunners were picked up by HMS Nyasaland (K 587) (LtCdr J. Scott, RNVR) and landed at Milford Haven.

King Edgar (British Motor merchant) - Ships hit by German U-boats during WWII - uboat.net

K.

[steve elliott]

Thank you Keith is there a way to find out if he was on the boat when it was hit

Also does anyone know where I could find out his war record

Thanks
Steve

[Keith at Tregenna]

Just found the post and trying, will look more and am certain others will be doing.

K.

[Ray Buck]

There was a Frank George Elliott age 25 with 1 ½ years service when signing on the “King Edgar” as Deck Hand (DEMS) 16th May 1942 in Cardiff
The ship arrived in New York on the 11th October 1942 having sailed from Cape Town South Africa 7th September 1942 the personal details match the info given
It is possible that he was on the ship at a later date and would be recorded on the ships official crew agreement.
The official No for the “ King Edgar” is 149947, the last crew agreement (if survived) should be in the TNA Kew in piece BT 381/3427 you would have to ask for the last agreement
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Ray

[steve elliott]

Ray I wish you could have heard my Dad's voice when I read this to him over the phone, thank you so much from both of us.

I would really appreciate any help or informaiton anyoen could give regarding my Grandfather and his service in World War 2

Thank you once again

Steve

[Ray Buck]

Steve
DEMS Gunners on Merchant ships are notoriously difficult to research as the records usually refer to an land accounting base, the only way, albeit difficult is to obtain the last known ship they were signed on and work backward through the ships crew agreements, usually they were required to state there previous ship as a Deck Hand each time they were assigned a ship
Ray

[Ray Buck]

Steve
a little more
Frank Elliott age 24 with only 10 months service signed as a DEMS on the “Empire Sunbeam” 12th September 1941 in Newport his abnormality proves it is him the ship arrived in New York on the 6th October 1941 having sailed from Newport Mon 13th September 1941
Ray

[steve elliott]

Fantatsic thank you, he had Two Thumbs on his left hand, the smaller thumb even had its own little nail.

My Dad tells me he came off King Edgar on the voyage before she was sunk. My Dad remembers his Dad telling him stories of the war of how cold it was on the voyage to Murmansk and that if the crew touched the rails with naked skin they stuck to them, my Dad thinks he served on at least one russian / arctic convoy.

Thanks Steve

[Hugh]

Welcome Steve,

Just to add a little to what Ray has posted. He is correct to say that DEMS gunners are very difficult to research and Maritime Regiment gunners probably more so than the RN gunners.

One of the reasons they are so difficult to research is because the ships he served on are not usually shown on the individuals service record. That said, the first place to look when researching any military person is to start with their own service record. Do you have it and if not do you know how to obtain it?

Regards
Hugh