Draw your own conclusions !!!!

[robpage]

On being shown around a Naval vessel many years ago , I was surprised by the high manning levels compared to a Merchant ship , on questioning it , I was told that is in case some get shot , maybe that is why they have all the Flag officers so they can shoot a few and not notice

[j.sabourn]

Always amazes me the amount of Admirals, Vice and Rear, that the Australian Navy produce for special occasions. I doubt very much that they have enough warships to go round to give them 1 apiece. As regards the high level of manning as you say they are at least doubled up on the specialists jobs. During the Falklands war I assisted in loading a small Hull tug which was going down with the fleet. There appeared to be more in the Naval Detachment (Radio and Communications) than the whole crew of the tug. As most and I would think all merchant ships that went would have had a naval presence on board for such as ciphers etc. they must have come to about double the ships complement on some vessels. Cheers John Sabourn

[happy daze john in oz]

Whilst in UK I read an article about giving one billion to Nigeria so they could join the space race.
The way to do it is for thta money to be spent in UK on the space race, the crew of any spacecraft going to say Mars be all the politicians.
As for bringing back prison hulks forget it #9 last time they did that they were exported here to Oz. we have enough of our own lunatics runninmg the asylum without any more coming here.

[j.sabourn]

Regardless of the top brass with which our armed services are born to carry, I have every regard for our naval personell and foot soldiers so to speak. As have already said I worked with same for the best part of 4 years. This included Special Forces our own and others of friendly nations. Most of whom are normal persons although very dedicated to their job in most instances. They are human the same as us and well remember careening around Fort William in a Naval Bomb Disposal Unit visiting various pubs. The locals accepted this behaviour as just high spirits ( even though it was just beer we were drinking). Many a time had a Thunder Flash thrown in my cabin as a joke, no H and S to worry about in those days. The UKs armed forces the same as Australian, the general populance owes a lot to. Regards John Sabourn

[Hugh]

There appeared to be more in the Naval Detachment (Radio and Communications) than the whole crew of the tug. As most and I would think all merchant ships that went would have had a naval presence on board for such as ciphers etc. they must have come to about double the ships complement on some vessels. Cheers John Sabourn

Hello John,
I was on the chartered ammunition ship 'LYCAON' ex-Blue Funnel. There were 7 of us I think in the naval party, 4 of us were comms, 1 medic, 1 CPO and 1 officer in charge. The ship had her own radio officer. I think a lot of MN personnel don't truly understand the RNs role and seek to compare it with their own ships. RN ships have always been top heavy with crew for various reasons. Communications traffic on warships would be too much for just one or two ROs. A merchant vessel has a defined crew list for its role, whether a tanker, cargo, coaster etc. A man-o-war has a completely different role. It is primarily a fighting platform at sea and it needs its manpower to sail and fight in that role.

However, as has already been pointed out, we are top heavy with brass and that's because the Govt have done away with our fleet. Problem is they still have not done away with our role in the world i.e. permanent member of the UN, U.S special relationship etc. To my mind if you want to have that amount of influence in the world then you can't do it with a fleet of coasters. That is slightly unfair of course as some of the ships we do have and those coming along are the best in the world.

Regards
Hugh

[Hugh]

remember careening around Fort William in a Naval Bomb Disposal Unit visiting various pubs. The locals accepted this behaviour as just high spirits ( even though it was just beer we were drinking). Many a time had a Thunder Flash thrown in my cabin as a joke, no H and S to worry about in those days. The UKs armed forces the same as Australian, the general populance owes a lot to. Regards John Sabourn

John,
Is that my home town you were careening around in
Regards
Hugh

[j.sabourn]

Know what you mean. Anyhow most MN ships don't even carry a Radio Officer and haven't for some time. Communications is a vital quality in any warlike situation. On one of the supply vessels which was converted for coastal patrol around the Falklands after the final outcome, I had to go down for the trials after the conversion, she had a couple of Bofors on the wings of the bridge and one was manned by the ships cooks (RN) and the other by the Royal Marine detachment on board. Also the 2 Fast patrol craft were manned by R. marines. The sergeant major of marines was the one who had to cede to the argos on the island of South Georgia that they first landed. He was raring to go back. John Sabourn

[j.sabourn]

Sure is we used to do a lot of saturation diving in various locks. Were known as Naval Party 1007. Cheers John Sabourn

[Hugh]

A list of Naval Parties here: http://www.naval-history.net/xBW-RNNavalParties.htm
I see NP 1007 was 'SEAFORTH CLANSMAN' 81-87 and 89.
I was in NP 1900 'LYCAON' 82, 83 and NP 1015 'OIL ENDEAVOUR' 84.

Regards
Hugh

[j.sabourn]

If my memory is correct I believe the conversion on the vessel I was there for the Trials before handing over to the Navy was renamed HMS Guardian or Sentinel or something similar. Cheers John Sabourn