Cruise ships of today SCARE THE HELL OUT OF ME.

[Trampshipman]

Floating disasters just waiting to happen !

I sailed in tankers and `tramps` [though mostly in `tramps`] in the 40`s/50`s era, and the ships of my day were pretty small compared to the `Goliaths` of today. I never had much time for passenger ships, regarded them as nothing more than floating hotels. However, I must say that the ships of that time did at least look like ships. They had sheer and grace and beauty, were lovely to look at ! Quite unlike the hideous monstrosities of today, the ugly floating apartment blocks or tower blocks which are all from `Disney Land` and completely lacking in any sense of grace or beauty whatsoever. Many of the old `tramps` also had beautiful lines and even the plainest of old tramps at least had `bags of character` which certainly cannot be found in todays huge `box boats`. [ I do realise that the old windjammer men probably said the same things about the coming of steamships ].
I well remember hard times in quite small ships battling atrocious weather and being practically `underwater` for days on end. I remember being `vessel not under command` for almost three days in the Bay of Biscay, the ship being battered and hurled about `here there and everywhere` by incredible winds and the most ferocious of seas. This because the ship just did not have sufficient power to maintain `steerage way` under those conditions. There was no one on the wheel [it would have been pointless] and the wheel was just `lashed fast`.
I come now to the point of this dialogue. The point is that throughout many such experiences at sea I was never ever at any time scared. I found such experiences to be exhilarating and challenging. This I promise is not said out of BRAVADO, but maybe is an example of the `foolishness of youth`. The point I wish to make is that whilst I was never scared on those ships of old, these hideous and monstrous cruise `ships` [?] of today just SCARE THE HELL OUT OF ME ! Maybe they should, maybe they shouldn`t ? Though I`ll tell you why I feel this way.
The truth is that I have never even stepped aboard such a vessel, However there are factors relating to them which disturb me. I read accounts of problems with unruly and `mouthy` passengers , people who it seems cannot accept reason or common sense, and of how crew members are unable to control such people. I read of poorly trained and even untrained crew members who in the event of an emergency would be unlikely to know their `a—es from their elbows`. In fact I get the impression that there really are very few real seamen around these days anyway. I read also of mixed crews of different races, half of whom cannot understand what the other half are saying. THAT must be A REAL MORAL BOOSTER in times of crisis ! Actually concerning some of todays seafarers [note I did not say seamen !] I seem to recall an incident from a few years back when a Greek cruise ship had a fire in the engine room. Apparently in no time at all the crew including the Master had taken to the boats leaving the passengers aboard to fend for themselves. I seem to remember that the passengers actually put the fire out themselves before later being rescued, and that the captain of the ship was eventually jailed for his actions. Anyway, to return to my point.! I look at the sheer size of these huge modern monstrosities, and the incredibly ridiculously huge numbers of passengers they will carry. I consider the reports of indiscipline among these passengers of today. [ not like the days of Titanic, Birkenhead, and many others ]. I think of the apparent lack of real well trained seamen today, and the apparent level of incompetency in some of todays crews. I think upon these things and I imagine the probable absolute panic and sheer bedlam which could ensue should one of these monstrosities be stricken with a real crisis. I`m afraid I regard all such vessels as `gigantic floating disasters just waiting to happen`.
I accept that ALL ships [ considering their purposes and their environment ] could logically be regarded as potential disasters waiting to happen. However, bearing in mind the potentially massive SCALE of such disasters happening to these modern `Goliaths`, then yes ! they really do SCARE THE HELL OUT OF ME !
To my mind building such `creations` [note I still will not call them ships !] is nothing short of madness, though of course will continue if out of greed alone.
Is there any one out there of like mind to myself ? Or have I been reading the wrong sort of literature ? OR am I simply being `paranoid` ? Then again, some might say that I`m `just an old dinosaur`!
Come on now, I really do want your views on this one !

Regards to all , Ken.

Note:- Posted on other sites also.

[Duke Drennan]

Thanks for raising this point Ken, it's one that I've thought about very often and have discussed it with friends and family on many occasions. The point I'm talking about is "fear". Like all of us on this crew, I've had my share of the Bay numerous times and other locations too. Working on deck in those conditions was, as you say, "exhilarating" and the adrenaline that went through you kept any thoughts of fear away. As stupid as it may sound, I specifically remember saying to myself sometimes during a storm, "what a way to go". People think I'm crazy when I say that but they'd have to experience it to understand what I mean. I've got to believe that many of us on this site experienced exactly the same thing.
It's too bad that our era has passed, so many teenagers of today cannot even grasp a mental picture of what we did. But you know what, when our time comes, we can at least say we "lived a life", and one that can never be recaptured by anyone else now.
Going "deap sea" was the ultimate.
Cheers guys.

[Kevin Mercer]

Well thanks lads for making me feel much happier with regard to the apartment blocks now masquerading as ships........I am going on a cruise in the Med in August on one of these boats and agree with what you say. I am only going because of an offer of one third of the normal price thanks to my brother in Los Angeles who fixed it up for me. It may be the last chance for us to get together so what the hell.
I was looking at the deck plans for the ship ( MS Noordam, Holland -America Line ) I nearly fell off my chair when I read TEN decks, bow to stern. But from what I can glean so far,no real outer decks. So instead of leaning on the taff rail with a fag watching the oggin rush by I will be looking through a window, not a port .
So no wind scoops either !
Most of the time at sea will be at night so it will be just a big taxi from one port to another and when you do dock there will be about 2,000 people trying to get ashore at once. Hells-bells
I remember in the 60's when I was at sea we never went ashore if there was an American Cruise ship in, the prices were sky high...... now I might be one of the flaming causes !! Never mind, it will be great to get on board a ship again and feel a bit of roll. Who am I kidding.( and I'll only get one Sunday at Sea !)
Ey-up the tugs are here
Kevin

[happy daze john in oz]

In the days when ships were ships, men were men and the sheep were scared I recall going through the Bight on a 10,000 tonner and thought we were in a submarine. so much for ships and the weather. But do agree the 'ships' of today are little more than floating apartment blocks, though there are a few that still look reasonable. But look at the cars of yesteryear and compare them with those of today. Having done a few cruises I have come to the conclusion that it is only a floating holiday, which for many of today is a great way to enjoy such a passtime. For me it is a way to get back on some form of ocean and enjoy the various ports of call by going my own way and not following the herd.

[Kevin Mercer]

Yes John you are right about getting back afloat and the anticipation of the next run ashore. It will be nice not to have to put on a damp boilersuit and slide down the handrails into 130 degrees. Wishing you weren't on the 12 to 4 and having to blow the ruddy tubes.
Kevin

[Ivan Cloherty]

Hi Kevin and all

Read all your comments with avid interest and could not agree more with the sentiments expressed. I recently spent some time in Cannes gazing seawards at all these floating hotels arriving and leaving and remenscing with myself about life at sea in the 50's and 60's and trips across the Bay in submarines masquerading as cargo ships. Have friends who are regular "Cruisers" who tell cruise virgins "don't worry the ships don't roll" so whats the bloody point of going on them! Hotels don't roll you go on aship to get something different seems most go on for the gigantic amounts of food you can gorge in 14 days at no extra cost.Oh for the days of that nice gentle roll while crossing a calm sea, the sun shining and the porpoise racing you, now that IS going to sea.

Whilst dreaming in Cannes and watching tenders being lowered and passengers embarking and disembarking from them in calm waters it scares the hell out of me imaging what would happen in a rough sea, no engine power and therefore stabilisers redundant and inexperienced crew who cannot communicate with each other, those hotels are going to roll!

In the old days you could tell a liner even when she was hull down on the horizon, you could even name her from the rake of her masts, the rake of her funnels and crosstrees etc. Even our bread and butter tramps were distinquishable by their masts and funnels, those super streamlined South American Saint Line, the upright stance of Blue Funnel and the thin funnels of Ben Line, the forest of masts on a Beaver CP ship and numerous other lines that seemed to be proud of the profiles. Living in Torquay we get a lot of modern boxes anchoring for orders or pilots, the only resemblance they have to ships is that they are sharp at one end.

But then the good old days were always the good old days no matter what era we live in, butthos of us who served on 40's 50's and 60's design ships knew we were on ships and not a hote

All the best to all
Ivanl

[Trampshipman]

Ivan, Liked the `sharp at one end` bit. Glad to find there`s still one or two around who share my views
on modern `ships`[?]

Ken.

[Trampshipman]

Yes it`s me again !
I imagine it`s mainly youngsters who `actually like` these floating `apartment blocks`. Still, that`s quite understandable since they haven`t really known anything else.
I just wish to say thanks for all your views, and I hope there may be a few more to come. I may well have `started something` with this one.

Regards to all,
Ken.

[happy daze john in oz]

Well who ever said modern ships do not roll has never been on one. I agree most try where ever possible to only sail on smooth seas. But the weather can be fickle and cares not about the ships. 30knot wind, slight seas and some will roll like a roller coaster, I know I have experienced it and loved every mnute as the only person on deck. Bit of salt spray coming over the bow and cre as well as bloods talking into paper bags, great fun to watch.

[Anthony Atkinson]

Hello Ken from Merseyside, I can remember when chippy used to knock up a Thunder Box on the aft end. I just can't somehow see that happening on the ugly passy things. I too cannot call them ships. I've just driven throuh Dover here in Kent, and there is a whacking huge block of flats berthed on the western arm. They only call in for twelve hours, and then off they go. Regards to you. Anthony Atkinson 796905