The Great British Shipbuilding Revival

[Lewis McColl]

Not stirctly true it is also down to employers not wanting to train apprentices they expect the government to do that. Also during the contruction of the hulls for the new carriers BAE contracted in Polish welders as they were cheaper than employing british welders.

[Keith Tindell]

Cheaper Polish welders, this country is awash with exploited immigrant cheap cheap labour, and most of the money they earn is sent back in to Europe to be spent there, exactly the reason for the decline in the MN, flag of convenience gives the ability to exploit foreign cheap labour, kt

[John Pruden]

sadly keith that is the way business is today. I still cant get my head around the costs of shipbuilding take any naval ship it must first go to architects then planners then cost control and a price must be put forward but yet the price is always way out any business if you give the cost you must suffer any loses by your company but it never works that way it could be the Koreans are better at putting a ship together cheep labour as well? jp

[Jim Dixon]

Post No. 12 Forget the cheap Polish Workers, FOC's etc. They know there worth. The days of thinking you employ monkeys and pay them pea-nuts went out in the 70s. I can remember the days of settling shipyard accounts with a briefcase. They are long gone. What the Poles do have is a desire to work and they are good at what they do.

- - - Updated - - -

They know their worth! My edit button does not function.

[Jim Dixon]

sadly keith that is the way business is today. I still cant get my head around the costs of shipbuilding take any naval ship it must first go to architects then planners then cost control and a price must be put forward but yet the price is always way out any business if you give the cost you must suffer any loses by your company but it never works that way it could be the Koreans are better at putting a ship together cheep labour as well? jp

Well, sadly John this is the way the world has gone. However, do not think of labour in the Far East as cheap. This is a fallacy. The labour costs in Japan and Korea match or exceed that in the UK. The quality is light years ahead of UK. China is cheaper but catching up. Also think of Filipino crew. People like to think they are also cheap again a fallacy. AMOSUP agreements which control the wages will give an AB USD 2000.00 per month (clear) hardly peanuts. Filipino Master's can expect up to USD 11,000.00 per month(clear). I mention this as I detect a certain lack of awareness in posts.

[Keith Tindell]

So where lies the answer, if all our workforce is outdated, perhaps this is the reason so many go on benefits, if the country is not prepared to invest , then we might as well curl up and let the Far East have it all. Not a ship building point of view, but I stayed in a hotel in Norfolk last winter, all the staff were Eastern Europeans, and totally exploited, working 12 to 18 hours a day, they would be cooking one day, bar duties at night, making beds in the morning,all for basic wage. And this was the Great Western hotel chain, no wonder they are aghast that the supply of slave labour will dry up on Brexit. I am sure most on here would not like to see their son or daughters working under those type conditions. As regards the Polish work ethic, I applaude it, as I have stated before, I wanted a fencing contractor to erect a fence in my property, I phoned 3 only 1 responded, the rest could not be bothered, These were self employed people, maybe life too easy for them ?so I can see both sides of the story. Thank god I,m out of the workforce today, KT

[Captain Kong]

Also the Unions Prevent apprenticeships.

A friend was a Sales Manager for a stainless steel profiling company. he told me.........
They employed Two Apprentices, One day the Union man turned up and had a word with the Two, then went to the Managers Office,
He told them that as the Apprentices were working the same hours as the Skilled men they should be on the same wage. or he would call a Strike.
The Boss called the Two Apprentices into his Office and in front of the Union Man gave them their cards.,
You do not work here anymore thanks to your Union Man. close the door on your way out.
And Two Future Skilled men lost their jobs and apprenticeship.
This must happen all over the country.
Brian

[john walker]

There are some very cynical posts on this thread. One of the reasons a lot of folks on this site voted to get out of the the whole EEC mess is so that people in the U.K. can PRODUCE things in the U.K. FOR the U.K. That are as GOOD as what other countries produce around the world. I for one do not believe we have lost that capability? If it means the U.K tax payer has to subsidies the rebuilding of our heavy industries and the training of people to carry out the craft skills that are necessary to manage that then so be it. We here in the U.K. are in a unique position to try and START AGAIN WITH A NEW INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION before those skills are lost . we should rejoice at the prospect and not fret at the Jap/Korean/Chinese competition. As for the idea of Polish welders being a threat well we should not give a toss. A little faith in our own capabilities MIGHT NOT GO AMISS .

[Captain Kong]

I agree John
But the Unions in the past have a lot to answer for in the losing of jobs. The Trade Unions should be Backing Britain.
Brian

[Jim Dixon]

I would agree with your post Brian and in principal with the previous however, we do have a problem in the UK and the Unions do not help. I lost a few good positions at sea in the 70s due to the ITF and their interfering 'stormtroopers' aka RMT officials. At sea we could always identify a budding union official. He was a 'head worker' and usually found jobs like an inside guy man when topping and lowering derricks.