Pool fisher anniversary.

[j.sabourn]

#19.. Ivan must have been 89 or 90 wintertime in the North Sea, a trawler forget its name put out a mayday, I was no more than a couple of miles away, but was hove to and going backwards in a force10. There was no way I could get closer, she was in contact with Aberdeen coastguard. After a while there was silence so assumed she had gone down. It was not an untoward incident as it was not an infrequent occurrence in the north sea in wintertime as well as choppers coming down. I always try and switch off and not try and remember. The general public as said once before have no idea of shipping casualities. Is the usual how much mileage can the media get out of it. Also in the same year a good friend of mine was lost overboard shortly after I had left the ship. They did recover the body later as was floating kept afloat probably by the air in his boiler suit. On making enquiries the going rate for a seaman then was 30,000 pounds. Not much for a human life especially when he is the breadwinner in a family. John Sabourn

[Ivan Cloherty]

Still a sad fact of life today that ships disappear without trace, and also situations where it is impossible to assist even when you know what their fate is going to be. Many of us have been in situations when weather has prevented us from reaching those we wish to help at the risk of our own lives, but we never thought of that latter aspect, they were fellow seamen in trouble and it was inbuilt in us to go and offer what assistance we could, we never thought that we would 'go down'. My first experience of this as a young lad was going to assist the sailing ship 'Pamir' in the North Atlantic in the 50's. a ship crewed mainly by cadets, she sank with the loss of about 80 cadets aged between 16 and 21, we couldn't reach her in time as her last reported position was incorrect. We searched and searched but had to give up as our own ship was being torn apart. Six survivors were found by a USAF plane some days later whilst searching from its base in the Azores.

I don't think the attitude of seamen has changed, when the chips are down they will put their own lives at risk to go to the assistance of others, it is something that is inbuilt into our calling, hpoefully it will never change.

Sorry if the 'Poole Fisher' post seems to have been hijacked, but I am guessing that the guys on that ship will not object as long as we keep it respectful and keep their and fellow seafarers sacrifices in the forefront.

[cappy]

in the cologne cathedrai is a plaque to the crew of the pamir......a fine sailing training vessel .....it was sad to see the names listed many just boys ....at the moment there is a old banger held in shields I believe Taiwanese ...they have not been paid for months ......they ran out of food coming from the azores I believe and she is not in a safe condition .....the crew being fed by the mission ......she is named Donald duckling and is a fair sized vessel by all accounts ....john arton may have better info of the current situation

[j.sabourn]

#23.. Ugly Duckling.. sounds like one of my exs. Know of one such ship which had same problems. The crew unless the Laws have been changed have a lien on the ship for all wages owed them. Everyone except the Master who may have skinned out by now. If there was a union as such the Owners would be found guilty in a maritime court and have to sell the vessel ( if she s worth anything) and the crews wages are the first debts to be paid. All other debtors coming behind them. Sure there are plenty of Maritime Lawyers in Shields.( Plenty of sea lawyers any way.) If had been the old days sure one of the Newcastle shipowners would have bought her for the scrap value if nothing else. Cheers John Sabourn

[John Arton]

In all the years I spent at sea I only lost one guy overboard and that was when I was a cadet, homeward bound in the North Atlantic on a forest product ship. We were hove too in the tail end of a hurricane with huge swells running when the Spanish carpenter decided to go forward to investigate noises coming from the focsle store. Instead of using the under deck tunnels that le d from the engine room directly to this store, or using the walkway over the top of the timber deck cargo, he instead chose to go up the narrow walkway between the ships side and the gantry crane rails on the main deck. We were all screaming at him to get back to safety but either he could not hear us or chose to ignore us. He was just by the no.1 gantry crane (we had three travelling gantry cranes fitted) when a huge sea came on board, picked him up, smashed him against the crane before washing him over the side. Some of the crew demanded that the captain turn the ship around to search for him but if he had done there would have been a fair chance that she would have broached too and capsized such was the height of the swells, so we had to do nothing. This led to a mini mutiny by some crew members which led to us having to lock ourselves in the wheelhouse whilst one or two of them were attacking the wheel house doors with fire axes. eventually the Spanish bosun ( a very quiet unassuming guy who the whole crew were terrified of) managed to restore order. I can never forget the sense of loss (needlessly) of this guy who had been one of my best mates amongst the Spanish sailors and with whom I had been polishing my Spanish language skills with.
rgds
JA

[Captain Kong]

In the Pool Fisher incident there were a few things I disagreed about, I was not happy about certain peoples attitude on my ship. Also it had to do with my company as well.
I dont know if it would open Pandoras box or not. after all it is 34 years ago. and the people concerned are probably dead by now.
I have been thinking about it since day one.
Problem,

Brian.

[Ivan Cloherty]

In the Pool Fisher incident there were a few things I disagreed about, I was not happy about certain peoples attitude on my ship. Also it had to do with my company as well.
I dont know if it would open Pandoras box or not. after all it is 34 years ago. and the people concerned are probably dead by now.
I have been thinking about it since day one.
Problem,

Brian.

Brian, sometimes it's hard but let the dead lay in peace, as you say it may open a Pandora's Box and even hurt those you may wish to protect. If you know in your heart that you did all you could, and what was in your power to do at that time, then let it lay in peace. Upon reflecting on our past we always have self doubts about what action we took, but hindsight always raises its ugly head to make us say 'if only' or 'what if' but that 'if only/what if' wasn't available to us at that time. We cannot change the past but we can protect the memory of those we care about and sometimes speech is silver but silence is golden. Rgds Ivan

[Captain Kong]

Thanks for that Ivan
What I did was correct, it was actions and attitudes of my fellow Officers and Master that I have issues with.

I realise that nothing could be achieved by opening the `BOX` but all was not right with these people,
I did get a Commendation from the Wreck Commissioners for acting in a Seamanlike Manner.
Cheers
Brian

[j.sabourn]

Brian, I know exactly what you are saying. After any disaster there is always the shouters of what they did, when in fact most of them did nothing. I never decried anyone involved in my part of Hell. There were plenty of vessels at the P.A.s destruction there were to my knowledge 2 FRCs and one workboat involved in the actual rescue of survivors, other boats supposedly broke down or were out of commission. When it was all over bar the shouting there were boats all over the place, appeared out of nowhere. Before going into the enquiry 9 months later a certain person involved off another vessel came up to me and said we all know what you did out there , but there is no need to say too much, or words to that affect. I do not decry anyone else involved and never have, only those who wanted to promote themselves as being the sole members at the party. These however were not seamen. What I have done is put everything on paper that I can remember put in big brown envelopes and deposit with family members to open in years to come when I am not here. This was the only way I could rid myself of this frustration of having to live with certain people coming out with a lot of crap, but as said these were not and never will be seamen. As Ivan says when you say too much you may be hurting other innocent people such as family and children of those lost. As you know it is just, past the 25 years anniversary and I did give statements to the makers of the documentary recently shown however it must have been decided that they may have been too inflammatory and hurt someone elses feelings. One person I strongly suspect has been making big bucks by lecturing to certain people in the oil industry, such as Safety Managers. He tried unsuccessfully to make certain issues both with his rescuers and the oil companies under the guise of the good Samaritan. People can believe what they want to believe, but I also can take the same attitude, but will do it in a less destructive way. If you have a clear conscience yourself that is the only thing that matters those that haven't have bigger problems than you. Regards John Sabourn