shootings in the usa

[Ivan Cloherty]

Rodney, thank you for your post #25, obviously written with passion and feeling and knowing facts perhaps unaware to the casual observer.(but unlikely to anyone on this site). Unfortunately it is the actions of the few that taint a nation, or profession, and regretfully that will never change and helps to formulate impressions in peoples minds, that's human nature and from your writing it obviously upsets you, possibly rightly so. I grew up in a thriving port city (Hull) and ALL seamen and trawler men were considered drunks by the non seafaring populace, I knew this was not so from family experience, my father being a seaman. Of course he liked a drink, as no doubt did (and do) many of us, but we are not drunks and I suspect many can live without any passing their lips. Similarialy some like guns and we understand that doesn't make everyone a criminal but unfortunately the picture is already painted, be it the USA or seamen. And of course we are seamen and are aware of geography also are aware of the physical size of the USA, distances involved and the nature of its land and its role in being the breadbasket of the world at times, so lessons are not needed there.

I doubt there is anyone on this site who did not shed a tear on hearing the news of the tragedy in Newtown and we do feel for the families and community and no we cannot comprehend the suffering they must be going through. So please do not do your fellow shipmates a dis-service by inferring, whether meant or not, that we do not understand the situation in the USA or the trauma and anquish that are currently being felt. Unfortunatey none of us are immune from atrocities in this ever changing world where ever we live. Whenever a tragedy happens there are always going to be comments made whether factual or perceived that's human nature, I doubt very much that that will change. Be assured that are hearts are with the families and communties at this time.


Statistics no matter how they are written I am always wary of, and they can be penned to suit the circumstances, I remember when living in Switzerland for a short time in the early 70's how the Swiss Government stated they had the highest increase in unemployment in Europe.........100%............ two people were unemployed in 1973 whereas the previous year it had only been one, this not meant to trivialise your statistics, but merely an observation.

Regards Ivan, and remember we are parents, grandparents and brothers (and sisters) so our hearts are affected by what happened

[John Pruden]

a gun is just a piece of metal same as a knife hammer etc its the dope who is wielding it that makes the difference the same day in china some crackpot lost it with a knifejp

[Captain Kong]

Hi Rodney.
There are a lot of shootings over here to, but I think Knife crime is on the increase. everyday someone is being stabbed to death, two yesterday.
If Guns are outlawed, makes no difference. The good guys give up their guns, The bad guys get to keep theirs. If a Baddy has no gun he can hire one in Manchester and then return it for a fee. If you want someone hit in Manchester there are certain people who will do the job for you for a fee, and it is not expensive.
The USA has its fair share of crazies, BUT I have met nothing but kindness, Friendliness and generosity from everyone I have met over there. and I do go there quite often, every year. I love the place and the people. and I have been in many States and places. coast to coast and inbetween. I have travelled for thousands of miles, on my own even sleeping in the car when I was out in the wilds with no motels handy. No problem.
I am going again on 31 January to San Diego, my son lived there for four years as a Doctor and also for a while in Seattle, he Loves it, He goes twice a year to San Francisco and then to Boston to give lectures at various medical conferences.
Nothing wrong with USA.,
I am scared of going down town in Bolton, never been down town for years , it is a no go area, for violence.
Cheers
Brian.

[Lou Barron]

Oh what a very sad thing to happen to those wee children .
Is it not a terrible thing to happen .
i sure feel for those people who have lost their loved ones

[Jacyn Wade]

I too am feeling very, very sad for the loss of these 20 children and the unimaginable grief of their parents and siblings and my thoughts are with them. There are flags flying at half mast here in Canada too.

After reading the myriad of posts, many thoughts come to mind, probably too many to list here. I do think this latest shooting spree just might possibly be the catalyst to something being done vis-a-vis gun laws in the U.S. Obviously, it would be impossible to ban guns altogether and expect them to be destroyed. Perhaps a start might be to restrict the amount of ammunition one could buy at a given time. As for the mentality of Americans, I have been to the U.S. many times and while they are generally very friendly and welcoming people, it does seem to me that they live in a sort of constant fear. Of what I really don't know, but there it is. More than likely, however, this incident will be "forgotten" in a couple of months and not much will change.

Another thought that comes to mind is the issue of all the other children in the rest of the world, especially in countries in the Middle East, Afghanistan, etc. who die every day due to war, poverty, drought, human slavery, etc. Are they not "murdered" too, albeit in a different manner?? And yet there doesn't seem to be the same level of shock and grief as in this case. Yes, the obvious answer is, it's not as close to home, but it's no less tragic and sad.

The next thought I will raise goes to the shooter himself. Very clearly, there was something terribly wrong with this boy, something that was probably not addressed as it should have been when he was younger. Would this be because he came from an affluent family and 'such things are kept quiet and behind closed doors'? We'll never know. This may raise some flack, but I can't help but feel sorry for him as well. I have to wonder about a woman who loved guns as much as his mother appeared to and took her sons to the shooting range. What is the lesson in this, I wonder? I don't like guns - as far as I'm concerned, they are the only weapon for which there is no self defense. If someone comes at you with a knife or a blunt instrument, you may have a few seconds to react and defend yourself. When a gun is involved, self defense is an impossibility. Perhaps this young man got the wrong message being brought up by a woman who loved guns so much? As I said, we'll never know.

And my final thought is this: There are a great many more children in this town who were not killed and they need to be remembered first and foremost. Closing the school permanently is not the answer and would send the wrong message to these kids. The passage of time and the right message will be the healer here and these children do not need yet more fear instilled into them. I can only hope they all get the proper care they need to be able to understand and cope with the loss of their friends and siblings.

My very deepest sympathy to the grieving families.

Jacyn

[Rodney Mills]

Dennis, my last post addressed to Rob was ment to be sent to you, I have amended my last thread and apologies and multiple thanks to you Sir.

Warmest regards and seasons greetings:

Rodney.

[happy daze john in oz]

USA, 315 million people and estimates 300million guns. Ban them all and what happens, the same as happens with drugs they come in from Mexico. There is no way they will ever ban guns in USA. Copy cat killings wil take place, platitudes about how we must never let this happen again will be voiced, and the cycle will run yet again. Man is the only animal, and to call him that is unfair to the real inimal population, that kills for pleasure, revenge, hatered or as a victim of mental disorder. We claim as homosapiens to be the smartest on this planet, let me tell you that is the dumbest statement ever made.

[Roger Dyer]

Not for the first time, Rodney (Mills), by virtue of your posts, I have been impressed by your frankness, humility, erudition and, perhaps, above all, your wicked sense of humour. Unfortunately, humour cannot soften the sorrow of what has happened. Of course, I realise that kudos are not what you seek, but I wanted to thank you for your honest, forthright, postings on this thread. Made at a time when the horror and sadness of what occurred at Newtown is so fresh in the minds of us all, your posts have given some 'balance' and understanding as to why the citizens of your great nation should find themselves in thrall to aspects of a constitution formulated so long ago, at a time when to load and prime a firearm took so much longer than it does today. A time when, I very much doubt, one man would have had the physical ability or inclination to commit such an horrific crime. I don't believe, for one minute, that John Doe has a burning desire to kill anything, man or beast, but I do struggle to understand the concept that in this modern age a person should feel the need to advantage an inherent 'right' to bear arms.

As a police officer in Australia, I carried a revolver on my hip for 33 years. During that time there were occasions when it was necessary for me to draw my revolver from it's holster anticipating a need to fire it at someone, thankfully it never eventuated. Several times I was required to kill injured animals, dogs, horses and cattle, but, thank God, never another human being. I have one close friend who, like me, was a former policeman and who, during the course of his service, had the misfortune of being shot and on a seperate occasion shot an armed offender dead. To this day I remain ever grateful that it was him and not me who was called upon to take a life, albeit justified. I tell you this only for the purpose of explaining a familiarity with firearms and a knowledge of the horrendous injuries they can inflict. As such, I confess to an abiding distrust of guns in the hands of the average citizen. I do not include persons with a proven understanding and efficiency in the handling of certain firearms, that is those who have a valid reason or need for the use thereof, such as professional shooters, licensed hunters or members of licensed gun clubs (target shooters, etc), on the proviso, of course, that they can fully justify carriage of a firearm at any given time. In my view there is absolutely no reason why anyone (other than a member of the armed services or a law enforcement agency) should have need of a miltary weapon, whether fully automatic or semi-automatic. It is also my honest opinion that anyone found in possession of a firearm without just cause should be automatically sentenced to 10 years imprisonment. Draconian, perhaps, but in company with firearm restriction, it might go some way towards reducing the incidence of mass-killing by morose, disturbed loners who, for whatever reason, take it upon themselves to visit such unnecessary cruelty upon their fellow-man. Yet again, there has been a slaughter of innocents, little children deprived of the opportunity of discovering that the world can be a wondrous place, as it was meant to be, but, in a moment of madness, that experience has been stolen from them by a civilian wielding a semi-automatic weapon(s).

I firmly believe the average American is a decent, friendly, caring human being, much like the type of person most of us imagine ourselves to be and one who is both horrified and greatly saddened by what has occurred. I also incline to the view that, unless they are prepared to demand their political representatives face-up to the 'U.S. gun lobby' and by so doing curb this incomprehensible, cultural, worship of firearms, then tragedies such as that at Sandy Hook School will become even more prevalent. I fervently hope that one day, soon, sanity will prevail


.......................Roger

[Rodney Mills]

Ivan Clohety:

I disapprove of what you say, but will defend to the death [well almost] your right to say it. Voltaire with assistance from me.

Rodney D.R. Mills

[Red Lead Ted]

Since the incident last Friday, There has been 900 shootings in the U.S.A. 600 Deaths a third accidental and 300 seriously injured, The problem is almost everyone in the U.S.A. Possess a gun, Most for self defence. In fact there were guns inside the school itself with a few staff trained to use them for self defence. I feel the general mood in the U.S.A. is gun ownership will never be any different there are to many obstacle's in the way of abolishment of gun ownership its not easy to change course over there. Sadly the parents of these poor children themselves will own guns. So how do they get of the merry go round. The truth is they never will Regards All Terry.