Female radio officers at sea mid 70's on tankers before sex disc Act

[Captain Kong]

They have a woman Captain on the QUEEN VICTORIA, a friend, a Chief Engineer, was introduced to the She Captain as `Todd Sloan` Chief Engineer, She said, "I do not shake hands with Engineers." and dismissed him.
Cheers
Brian

[j.sabourn]

#121... Brian think I have said once before... In 1957 was 3rd. mate with a 2nd. mates cert. The master mate and 2nd. mate were much older than me, and tried to influence me not to talk to Engineers. Much to their annoyance I used to go ashore with same. I was repeatedly warned against, and in the finish these Deck hoccifers would ignore me whenever they could. To anyone wanting to be correct and toe the line would have agreed with them and more than likely have succeeded more in the eyes of the Company. However I didnt agree and went my own way. In later years when communal messing etc. was brought in, a lot of these old timers of the past retired and went ashore. This particular master I had been with was a blow hard, and finished up on the west coast of Africa driving a supply boat, where he was soon seen through and was sacked as being incompetent. There were many excellent seamen of the old school but also a few others who tried to hide behind the screen of authority. These ones gave the proper seamen a bad name. Reading the posts of the female sparks she only saw the fringes of the bigotry that could and did in some cases go on. She was probably unlucky and got the very minor percentage of the MN. As regards the so Called Captain of the Queen Victoria, I would very much think this was a political appointment also, as was most female appointments at sea. I think Victoria Drummond being one of the only genuine ones. Cheers John S

[Ivan Cloherty]

#117, 'supernummeries' ie, 'One that is in excess of the regular, necessary,'

Seems like The RN & MN Higher Hierarchy held different views!

A supernumary at sea is someone who is not officially part of the crew, but who is entered on the Articles of Agreement to comply with safety regulations, mainly lifeboat capacity of the said vessel.

Whilst we seamen generally have great respect for women of all occupations, to place them, or even a single one, on a small island of steel usually occupied by about 50/70 men leads to a recipe for disaster because the hormones of both species become disturbed, a biological certainty. The appointment of women was a political correctness move not by the hierachy of the RN and MN who strongly opposed it because they could see that it would only lead to discontent and deflect a mans thoughts from his prime duty of thinking about the operation and safety of the ship and his shipmates. At sea, more than anywhere else the safety of the ship, it's men and cargo, whether it be MN or RN is the prime consideration 'at all times' there is no recourse to a helping hand from other sources if things go wrong and the male hormone is set in stone to protect the female of the species at the cost of all else, a dangerous aspect in our profession where clear thinking uninterrupted by misplaced gallantry can worsen a situation for all onboard. So our remarks are not made against women in general, for whom we have great affection, but in their venture of seeking equality in their roles ashore they have not realised that certain professions are best left to the male species but alas political correctness does not realise this.

[gray_marian]

Thank you John, Ivan, & others for your honest replies. I do however think with all due respect for your MN experience, implying men CANNOT control their hormones a disservice to the ones who most obviously did and do in all walks of life. I realise in a male-dominated environment that there will be problems between male & female but really that must be overcome in this day and age with opportunities available to all. I fully understand that situations arise when physical strength is of the utmost importance in certain scenarios and women then may not then be an asset. Of course to be fair to the chaps on here we are talking about the 70's and before in general, and whilst I do think Lucy must have been most unfortunate to have encountered some absolute horrors I can and do feel for her. To have worked hard to achieve her qualifications, some at her own expense to then be saddled with the dinosaurs she ended up with must have been soul destroying. Why should she have been expected to walk away? Personally I think that's appalling no one would expect a man to do that.Wonder what these degenerates on Lucy's ships would have felt if it had been their daughters?

[Ivan Cloherty]

Marian, we are not saying men cannot control their hormones, they certainly can and did, in my experience whilst women were on ships it was the WOMEN who could not control their hormones, no doubt excited by all those bronzed physical lean specimens they never encountered ashore doing jobs on deck and aloft that shore wallahs would not contemplate, and we all know that a woman scorned will try to get even when her advances are rebuffed, and believe me they had to be. With all respect my dear you have had to experience the situation to appreciate how normally sedate prudish women became ravenous tigers once the engine was started and the ropes cast off. I am not saying Lucy was of this ilk and had most of us who sailed in our time would have sorted out the miscreants in one way or another in very short order as we would for any other crew member who was picked upon regardless of sex. Whilst I appreciate that all are entitled to their views, unless you have actually experienced the scenarios you may find them impossible to believe, especially about some ladies who when ashore butter wouldn't melt in their mouth but when aboard and the vibrations started changed their persona.

[j.sabourn]

Marian I walked away from more than one ship. I was never sacked by a shipowner I sacked them first. Most of the older seamen on this site worked at one time or another on the 72 hour Running Agreement, it was usually expected that at least 75 percent would hand their notice in after one trip, which could be as little as two weeks to 6 weeks maxinum. The grass was always greener elsewhere, and most seafarers wanted change all the time, another ship another challenge and fresh places to see. Was a Nomadic life with much more to see than deserts. JS

[j.sabourn]

Ref 125... Ivan, is now getting Brian Kong all wound up and raring to go, he may pick up Cappy on the way and start pillaging Whitley Bay again. Brian you do know the Spanish City was pulled down, so will have to knock that off your list, the Rex is still there though a shadow of its former self. Cappy still has a shoot on sight notice on his head so keep him at arms length as may get caught in the cross fire. Cheers have a pint for me in the Briardene. JS

[cappy]

ivan that is so true ...many womenwho were paragons of virtue ashore .....became shameless on board a ship .......once aboard they were different people.....but many times the word was ...as the song will..... you still love me tommorow... to which a favourite reply was ...well i buys you chocolates dont i ........regards cappy

[cappy]

ivan that is so true ...many womenwho were paragons of virtue ashore .....became shameless on board a ship .......once aboard they were different people.....but many times the word was ...as the song will..... you still love me tommorow... to which a favourite reply was ...well i buys you chocolates dont i ........regards cappy

###will you still love me tommorow ...by the shirrelles ...perhaps somebody can put it on thesite in remembrance of all those girls ...who gave there all to us heartbrakers and some of us who had our hearts broken

[gray_marian]

#125,My Dear Ivan,

Not for one moment do I think some "women are innocents abroad" and without meaning to be crude those wanting to participate am sure would have found willing partners.......eventually. Am I right in thinking these women you refer to were passengers? If so then my point on Lucy's experience has been missed.

If on the other hand you are referring to female staff on board, then I would be interested to hear the male point of view on how this aspect was dealt with in a professional capacity, as I have not yet read of that circumstance on here.

This is addressed to any member on here who experienced such.