P&0 Merchant Navy Chief Engineer cap & uniform

[Valerie Barretto]

My father passed away recently, and he always spoke of his time in the P&O Merchant Navy as a Chief Engineer as some of the best times dad had.

He left in the mid 60s and I wanted to acquire a Chief Engineer's cap for his funeral.

There are so many designs that I am not sure exactly what cap dad would have had during those times as a Chief Engineer, so if someone could please kindly help me to identify what his cap would have looked like I would be most appreciate?

Valerie

[Tony Skilton]

The correct cap may be hard to come by, but a set chief engineer's epaulettes may be easier to find.
My boys are going to put a set on my box when the time comes.
Skilly

[j.sabourn]

Was it not shoulder epaulletes that P and O wore on their blues the same as Federal Steam Nav. Also it would have been company braid and not MN. Apart from merchant navy uniform wasn't company uniform considered livery. When you get into the old legal terminology you could be prosecuted for wearing illegally MN reconized uniform but livery was different. One company I was with supplied uniform and was grey and could in no manner or form be mistaken for MN uniform. As regards caps did the P and O have the policy of their chiefs of having scrambled eggs on their caps. Don't think the MN did only the master. Not being an expert as the last uniformed vessels I was on. Was a red boiler suit. Cheers JWS.

[john walker]

The correct cap may be hard to come by, but a set chief engineer's epaulettes may be easier to find.
My boys are going to put a set on my box when the time comes.
Skilly

There are several pairs of Chief Engineers epaulettes on ebay for under £30.00, or you can google ' Merchant navy outfitters ' most uniform items are still available but expensive including Senior officers caps which I think are the same for both Captain and Chief Engineer ? These seem to be about £120.00

[Captain Kong]

This is the Cap Badge pre 1972 so should be the one.
Brian

PS
If it is for the funeral , a GOOD Florist could make a copy of the badge in a display.
Quite easy and very effective. But a good florist is hard to find these days.
Anne could have done it when we had the flower shop. we did many displays like that.
set on a two foot square foam,
We did many, Horses, swans, cars , cats, anchors and many other patterns.

Good luck with it.
Brian

[j.sabourn]

Just what I was saying john don't think the chief wore the brass hat in the mn. In the RN yes the brass hat started at the full commanders rank and could be the engineering branch, communications or any other branch of the navy. The mn is a rough copy of but differs in badges , buttons and badges but is the same in shoes and such won't go into the underwear. The last time I had to check as to the correctness of dress was on a formal occasion but like most things forget if not doing regularly. Know that the prices quoted were a lot cheaper when I had to dig down to buy. Cheers JWS

[Valerie Barretto]

Thank you all so kindly. I have looked on ebay and when I returned home I saw that the cap was blue, which has thrown me off completely. There are not many blue caps available so I am even more confused.

I cant find the exact P&O epaulettes and there are so many versions of Chief Engineer 3 stripes, 3 stripes and a circle, 3 stripes and a diagonal, and I am not sure which it is.

[Ivan Cloherty]

Valerie as suggested by Terry (Red Lead Ted) in another post it may be better for you to drape the coffin in a Red Ensign, if you cannot borrow one from a Seamen's Mission, then you could obtain a new one from any good ship chandler or flag maker on the internet, one the size to drape over the coffin would set you back about £100, and rather than burying it with the deceased you could have it returned to you as a keepsake. You could then fly it every 3rd September 'Merchant Navy Day'(or drape it over your balcony) depending on your personal circumstances, and it would be a mark of respect for your father every year who obviously loved his job in attaining rank of Ch Engineer and also a mark of respect for all those who served at sea in your father's chosen profession and for those who sailed with him. Whatever you do he will be proud knowing that you have given it so much thought

[robpage]

black cap , no scrambled egg and a P&O cap badge . 4 stripes not 3 if I remember braid had 1/2 rising sun above stripes

[Lewis McColl]

Sorry Robpage It was a white topped cap no scrambled egg on the peak only the master had scrambled egg on the peak, 100% sure as I have one somewhere in my basement.