The Red Duster

[Raymond Bisseker]

How things change in a life time..only 78 years ago...I'm talking about shipping here....British Flagged ships..thousands of ships...the largest merchant fleet on the planet...Now what! For me, it's so sad........ Most of all WHY??

[cappy]

How things change in a life time..only 78 years ago...I'm talking about shipping here....British Flagged ships..thousands of ships...the largest merchant fleet on the planet...Now what! For me, it's so sad........ Most of all WHY??

cheap labour abroad,,,,,and commie usless unions here .....other countries getting wise ie greeks russians chinese....regards cappy

[Captain Kong]

Several Reasons Raymond.
The europeans stopped us trading with our Commonwealth and the rest of the world as we had always done. Our Wimps of Politicians went along with it in their ignorance of our world wide Trade or greed at the rewards that politicians were to get.
Along the way, that Bankrupted New Zealand as a Nation and near Bankrupted Australia, two great Nations that helped to save us from the stupid Europeans in two world wars and in history. We kicked them both in the teeth so we could go to Bed with the froggy French and germans. Europe wanted to destroy Britain's Trade with the world and our Commonwealth because they were envious of us and could not do it militarily so they did it without firing a shot.
We should have used Europe as a Nuclear Testing Ground, and then still been a world leader in trade and shipping.
I have never ever been to Europe since it was formed, I totally disagree with it and all its policies.
I have never set eyes on a euro note. and do not want to. Euro sounds like a bathroom noise after a bad night on the ale. Who wants that??
Cheers
Brian.

[Ivan Cloherty]

Apart from Brian's logical take on things, there were also other factors contributing to the demise of the Red Duster much earlier than the Europe factor. After WWII many of our former colonies or protectorates wanted independence which they obtained, with this independence came a desire to be seen on the world stage and the quickest way to do that (in those days) was to have your own Merchant Navy with your own ships flying the National Flag of the newly emerged nation. Not only were there the ex colonies of the UK involved in this change, but the ex colonies and protectorates of Italy and Germany gained their independence, nations such as Ethiopia and Sudan and others whose goods had been carried under the Red Duster, these ex axis countries also wanted their own Merchant Navies. All these emerging countries usually operated a cartel where-in goods exported could be carried on non flagged ships to earn foreign exchange and goods imported had to be carried on own flagged vessels to conserve foreign exchange and all coastal trade had to be carried in own flagged vessels to again conserve foreign exchange. The UK government of the day in its wisdom also decreed that they would help shipowners renew their fleets with short term tax breaks, on the proviso that the shipping companies did not scrap their old ships but sold them to emerging nations at just above scrap prices, which of course they did. This short sightedness by both the Governments and Shipowners meant that both the Govt and ship owner were actually shooting themselves in the foot, but could not see it, or if they did, then they ignored the long term consequences (e.g. Falklands). To add to this prior to joining the EU the Govt of the day removed trading restrictions around the UK coast, where-in the UK had operated a system similar to the USA where cargoes originating within the UK and terminating within the UK, the UK flagged vessels received preference for these cargoes if UK vessels were available. In addition to all this official short sightedness the seamens strike aggravated the down fall of the Red Duster because with the non availablity of UK flagged vessels, shippers and Receivers had to turn to foreign flagged vessels so that the necessary trade to keep the country running could be carried out. These Foreign vessels provided a cheap and reliable service, so much so that when the strike ended the shippers and receivers continued to use them and the trade was lost to the Red Duster. Then again as ships got bigger, less were needed to carry the same goods, less ships = less seamen, it would have inevitably come about through evolution of transport methods, but was hastened somewhat by the factors of govt, shipowners and the seamen themselves in the preceeding years, but hindsight is a wonderful asset.

[Louis the Amigo]

Hi shipmates, Tax dodger shipping companys, cheap labour, and safety at sea. Loads more excuses but we all know them all ? very sad but going to sea today is not very good.World-wide between 2002 -2011 250 cargo vessels were lost, causing the death of 800 sea man why???? cost cutting killing seaman for profit and greed. The swanland was one in the long line save money and kill good men, there are many ashore in cheap labour counrtys who will take they place some times? they come home alive with money in the pocket if they are lucky. long hours with no over time rates or contracts of employment. NO shipping owner has done a day in jail for they crimes the death of over 800 men WHY????????????

[Rodney Mills]

And not to forget jet engines for commercial airlines: that did away with passenger liners, the Royal and international mail ships, and the carrying of light cargo. The icing on the cake was the introduction of container ships and bulk automotive carriers, and the reflagging of ships to foreign countries.

I 'swallowed the anchor' in 1958, and emigrated to Canada, and emigrated from there to the U.S.. I had no idea that the end of the M.N. was a couple of years away. Just plain old luck, but it's sad.

Cheers, Rodney

[j.sabourn]

The Shipowner is a business man and his sole aim in life is to make money for himself and his shareholders the same as your high street bank. The decline of the British flag was due to purely more financial gains by employing less people at a less price. Forget your unions they had mostly a legitimate complaint and could be handled. Even during the war years the shipowner never lost out financially, he should have been made to man his own ships. The British Shipowner is a good example of how to be a millionaire on the backs of other people. He is still there working under the guise of a foreign flag, and although some may have received honours for so called contributions to the nation leaves a bad taste in the mouths of many. The government of the day worked hand in hand to cause the demise of the MN, and like hitler blaming the Jews, the unions were a happy substitute for the same blame,. JS

[Lou Barron]

Who won the war the countries that we have suppose to have defeated have done better than the UK who can we blame was it the our politicians or was it the attitude of the people
I do not like the Germans or the Japanese but they sure got stuck in and made there country of what it is today

[j.sabourn]

Lou, Germany has throughout history tried to be a dominant power, and as a leopard does not change its spots will continue to do so, even though is in a supposedly peaceful way. Japan I know your dislike for which is shared by many still alive who also shared similar fates to yourself. However against the so called self opinionated ideas of the UN and other so called well meaning ambassadors of the world they put restrictions on certain peoples entering and living in their country, which up until now and I hope in the future will keep them clear of the present troubles the western world finds itself in re wars etc in the Middle east. The other countries in Europe what can one say some want to just ride on the gravy trade of Europe as see it a way of enhancing their own future. Cheers JS

[Des Taff Jenkins]

HI Ray.
All of the above are correct, but there was a ****** in the woodpile, if you read Franklin D Roosevelt's auto biography he stated that when the war was over he wanted all of the British influence and if possible territory, they the Americans were the mainstay of European recovery and through the Marshal plan what they asked for they got, they still run Europe and NATO what they say goes,
If it was about cheap labour the yanks for one wouldn't be carrying their own cargo at the rates their seamen get, America after all is the capital of Capitalism.
Cheers Des

redc.gif May it fly proud again