MN Careers Open Day.

[Jim Brady]

They still recruit deck and engine apprentices there is one such open day today at JM Uni Liverpool where representatives from various shipping companies will attend.I see they have a 360% bridge simulator here,also it says no fees so maybe the cadets go on company pay right away.
I'l try and put up the link if i fail maybe Vernon can do it.
http://www.careersatsea.org.uk/liver...ty-...open-day.

Regards.
Jim.B.

[j.sabourn]

Jim, trying to get Uni graduates ???Can always remember 1 AB saying to me years ago, what we want is more ABs not BAs think the BA stood for Bl...y Ass....s. Maybe he could even foretell 60 years ago the future. Cheers John Sabourn

[robpage]

There are two types of engineers with degrees , those who did an apprenticeship and realised that they could carry on learning , and got a degree along the way .knowing that you never stop learning , and the buggers who got to know it all in three years at university

[Captain Kong]

When I joined the Statendam, Holland America Line last February, There was a Cadet from Blackpool on the same flight out to San Diego with us. it was his first trip.
He said he went to an open day event, spoke to the Trinity House man, and they said they would sponser him, they then flew him out to join the Statendam, No Training or any courses.
I asked the 2nd Mate a few days later how was he going on, He said he was OK and was learning fast.
So that is one way of doing it. I dont know what happened later as after a week I was taken to Hospital in Honolulu and missed the ship. another VNC in the book.
Cheers
Brian.

[John Arton]

John S and Brian
A Masters licence or Chief Engineers, has never been officially accepted ashore as a qualification equivalent to a degree, especially in the U.K.
The MCA has under the auspice of the STCW convention, has introduced foundation degrees that lead onto an O.O.W cert and higher and are slowly moving towards having both Masters and Chief Engineers licences being formally recognised as being a degree qualification, whichever route the person has chosen, either cadetship or foundation degree course. All courses have/will be accredited by leading universities' so in the near future anyone with a Masters licence (or Chief Engineers) will have a qualification that is recognised as a university degree.
Find it strange that Trinity House flew that cadet out without any prior training etc. as being sponsored by a U.K. outfit and also under the IMO regs, no one is allowed to be a crew member without having undergone some basic safety training etc. The only thing I can think of he was signed on as a supernumery and therefore not part of the ships official crew. Cadets cannot be used to make up crew numbers for the Safe Manning Certificate but are required to have basic safety training, personal and social skill training and a lifeboatmans ticket plus a couple of others, that they gain in their first college phase, prior to joining their first ship.
rgds
JA

[John Arton]

This is the route followed by all new entrants into the Merchant Navy
http://www.nafc.ac.uk/WebData/Files/...ET%20ROUTE.pdf
rgds
JA

[Captain Kong]

Hi John
I was only repeating what the lad told me.
unfortunately I was only there for one week and didnt have a lot to do with him just being a passenger.
If I had completed the 30 day cruise maybe I could have got more information.
I am on the Amsterdam in January and February, if there are any more I will try to find what system they operate.
Cheers
Brian,

[robpage]

Prior to 1969 ( + I believe 5 Years Grace ) a Chief Engineers certificate allowed registration as a Chartered Engineer , which is " Better " than a foundation degree , I felt at the time that the Institute of Marine Engineers did little to defend this position , and left said Institute . If you have a Class 1 certificate , then The City and Guilds Institute will by experience grant a Graduate certificate which is equivalent to a Honours Degree . From that you can obtain status as aan Incorporated Engineer , The qualification to gain Chartered status is now a Masters Degree .

[j.sabourn]

John in 1957 I approached the people recruiting for teaching training College. In those days they would recognize a 2nd. Mates cert. as the equivalent of one O level or whatever crap was in existence then. Think you had to have 3 to get in. I had a cousin (same name) who taught Engineering at your bode of work at present, he always said he wished he had gone for Extra Chiefs, as was better reconized than some of the qualifications that he had, which was a combined 1st Class. I started with Extra Masters in 1964, but as this entailed 2 years at the time had to forget it as was married and could not afford. There are certain people on this site with Extras whether they ever used it or not I wouldn't know, it was considered in my time a cert. for going ashore with. Even the Maths for second mate I would consider way above the standard of an O level during my time. So much for our Education Authorities. I don't know what the school leaving age is now in the uk, but was 15 during my time. I know out here see some big school kids, think they would be better off going and getting some real work experience. Regards John Sabourn

[j.sabourn]

John.. How times have changed re manning. One of the reasons why ships carried apprentices was because of the manning scales. For those out of Chapmans, and Runcimans and the likes, the apprentices were classed as either JOS,SOS,and AB if ship was left short handed. Regarding present cert. structure, in the 80s it was brought out the cert of service i.e. that anyone who had been sailing as master or mate uncertificated for a number of years was issued with such, was the start of this numerical thing 1 2 3 4 and 5. Looking back this must have been a start to get all these mickey mouse qualifications under the umbrella. Nice to know that looking to the future that one will be classed as holding a degree for no input whatsoever. However I am not a big believer in degrees when I see some of the people walking around with such, and don't think a diploma in some weird subject gives them the right to demand a job above someone without one. However if they really want one they are quite cheap to buy out East, probably hold the same value as well. I think the young lad is quite entitled to go to sea without some bigoted armchair beaurocrat saying otherwise. However once again these Laws apply to UK which no longer is a seafaring nation. We shall soon see who says yea or nay in shipping circles and doubt very much whether the uk will have anything to contribute. This privilege has been given away by our stupid past governments under various excuses. The countries having the biggest merchant fleets will have the say. Regards John Sabourn