THE GREAT LAKES

[j.sabourn]

Believe there was a post or a discussion about unsafe practices at sea earlier on. One of the regulations was going a foot or whatever it was off the deck, having to put a safety harness on. How could that ever equate to the normal and accepted practices which may still be going on regarding the Seaway. Another one which was only enforced when it was convenient was safe access to and from ships. I have joined and left ships being the 5th or
6th ship out having to clamber over the others, no gangways or anything, safety nets impossible to rig. My thinking on most safety nowadays that is drummed into us, is its ok when it suits. Most seamen know what is safe and what is not. These safety people with their expensive manuals are as usual making a good living off the backs of seamen, everyone else has in the past so why shouldnt they is probably the way they look at it. As regards dangerous cargos and how to handle as was brought up in one post, the info. was there already in BOT memos Carriage and handling of Dangerous cargoes. In effect all they are doing is reiterrating in a fancy book for the benefit of the owners on any possible insurance claims. I suppose we all have to make a living and they have found a good way of doing it. Just another grouse. Cheers John Sabourn.

[Ivan Cloherty]

Don't mind if I do John, my favourite whiskey, cheers

[aussie]

Did trip up Lakes August 1971 on Bel Hudson taking V W' s from Germany and loading grain for return trip. Had great crossings of all the Lakes and the scenery was amazing. Remember crowds of people at Eisenhower Locks watching us rise up in the locks. We exchanged coins with the kids and chit chat with the people. Loved Toledo and Chicago. Had heaps of pics from trip but sadly had them stolen when on another ship in Mozambique. But still have the memories. Have to say one of the best places i went to in my time in Merchant Navy.

[j.sabourn]

Thought you called them Low Fliers like most scots do Ivan. Cheers John Sabourn

[DeepSea]

Did a total of ten round trips up the Great Lakes carrying steel from Middlesbrough and Brazil and would load grain up at Duluth and Thunder Bay for the continent. The spillage from the grain was usually bagged up and handed over at one of the locks downbound and was used to feed the ducks in the winter. Have been up the lakes on the opening of the season around March and one of the last ships out before the winter freeze, although we used to get a two week Indian summer, I believe around October time. Never experienced any real bad seas crossing any of the lakes, that stand out in my mind. The ships I worked on for Bolton's were all specifically designed for the lakes, 30,000 ton max. long ships with a relatively short beam, so would roll like a b*****d in the Atlantic on the way over.

[j.sabourn]

Ref.previous post steel cargoes. We used to carry the Hot rolled and cold rolled steel from Japan to Detroit for the car industry. As draft is restricted to either 25 ft. 6 ins, or 27 feet 6 ins. cant remember which figure it was now, we used t have to lighten ship usually in Philadelphia. Used to love the Lakes, the only problems were getting up and through the locks. Coming out with grain most holds were slack as could not load to full capacity, however the grain regulations still applied so had to figure out the cheapest way to do to confirm to regulations, before topping off either in Montreal or Three Rivers normally. Another problem was the 300 tons or so of dunnage which had to be pulled out of the holds after carrying steel, which had to go through customs before being burned ashore in incinerators. Many small problems up the Lakes, as well as their union regulations. Chicago was one. The crew could not touch the derricks. Ship had to arrive alongside with derricks at 45 degrees, thereafter until after ship left could not touch. Its a pity their unions werent so keen on having proper linesmaen available on the approach walls in the Locks. Regards John Sabourn.

[Paul Racine]

Dont know how the safety manual would handle the swinging of seaman ...........

John
Interesting comments!........ I went online and found and found a 2002 copy of The Seaway Handbook issued by the St Lawrence Management Corp.In one of the chapters they state that crewmen being put ashore on landing booms and handling mooring lines on tie up walls shall wear Canadian or US Coastguard approved life jackets.........Gee, thanks a lot!........I guess this answers your question.If this was the norm in 2002 I guess it's the same now. I remember climbing down a pilot ladder and jumping the gap between the moving ship and the quayside.We never wore life jackets. Ah to be young again.
Bob:
I've never heard of the area at the beginning of the Welland canal called Racine, but there is a city in Wisconsin of that name.
Regards
Paul
.

[Stan Carter]

when I first came to canada, I lived in Brockville, a city at the start of the thousand islands. During the summer months we would spend time doing the tourist things like pleasure trips through the islands on both sides of the border. plus a lot of time spent at the locks watching the frieghters and tankers up and down bound. But Robin mentioned the small island with a castle on it. It's known as Bolt Island and is on the US side of the channal. The story is it was bought untouched by the owner of the Waldorf Astoria, who was an immigrant from europe who worked his way up the chain at the hotel until he bought it. As a sign of his lasting love for his wife, he started to build the castle approx three quarters through the project his wife died and from that day on he stopped all work on the island and walked away from it. For years thats how it stayed for years, the tours by boats from both sides would circle the island and they started to stop off there. Non americans had to go through customs and immigration, with passports and visa's. Canadians could disembark by showing a drivers licence, that changed sfter 9-11, now we have to present passports.
Anyway approx 5 years ago the us government started a the project the finnish the castle and today it's about finished. We usally take the three hour tour from Gananoque at least once a year, starts out on the canadian side across to the us side down the millionairs row on the ship channel around bolt castle and back to the canadian waters, well worth it.
regards, stan.

[j.sabourn]

Paul, its a wonder our brilliant safety experts havent suggested or should say demanded the wearing of a safety harness during such operations. I dont think anyone who hasnt experienced this job understands the dangers associated with it. Thanks for looking up and still see we are living in the past century, however would also be interesting to know how they now cope with decreased crew sizes. Cheers John Sabourn.

[j.sabourn]

Paul this handbook does it give all the things like the whistle having to be hooked up to a flashing light. How some of the signals for alteration of course etc. are different than normal at sea as we know it. There were quite a few different small items which would have to think about to try and remember, but the lakes navigation had some peculiaritys to us as regards Rule of the Road etc. There were also Class A and B pilots in the lakes think they were berthing and some lake transit ones, for certain parts of the Lakes. My time in the Lakes the water was pure and could use for consumption. When I was there on holiday a few years ago it was polluted the same as everywhere else. There was no discharges to lake from ship apart from engine cooling water, and if ship did not have a sewage tank, all chemical toilets had to be fitted throughout the ship. The poor old topaz had to clean all these out , after clearing the lakes. Cheers John Sabourn P.S.I know Ivan is going to say did the Topaz have to clean the lakes as well. So should have said Clearing the lakes and getting back into the St. Lawrence river. Cheers.