Chutes and life boats

[happy daze john in oz]

There we were one day at sea, just before new year,in the self service buffet. We had just sat down when an officer came and asked could he sit with us? I told him I had paid a lot for this cruise and did not expect to have to eat with the crew. The officer turned out to be Craig Street the ships captain. He laughed and commented that he had met me two nights earlier at the captaisn cocktail party. On asking how he could possibly remember one out of the 450 or so that were there he replied, easy, you were the only one with an MN badge on your lapel.

He went on to explain that when at sea he would make very effort to take breakfast and lunch in the self service so he could talk with the passengers. I had come across a similar situation once before with Royal Caribbean.

Having gone thorugh the usual comments I got to asking about the ships life boats. I commeneted that there were only some 12, six each side, inflateable life rafts where as on some of the companies ships there would be as many as 20 each side. went on to explain that there were two life chutes, simlar tom those on aircraft, situated on the boat deck. Fine, but what if the life boats cannot be lowered, all very well 'chuting' persons into the water but they then have to go into some form of life craft. He made comment that the 22 lifeboats would be sufficient to take all souls on board. I then went on to say what if you get into a 'Titanic' situation, it did go down on its' maiden voyage.
He assured me that modern shipping was far more secure and that if operated correctly, not like the Costa Concordia, he was confident there would be no problems.

I was then invited to join a few others on a bridge tour, restrictions have been somewhat relxed over the past two years, to see the way modern ships work. So different now, no one on the wheel, what wheel, all is now computerised with two on the bridge just to monitor the system. As he pointed out it is now so complex and automated that all they do is put in co-ordinates, port of next call and all is done.But for all of that there are still many ships out there, mainly cargo and tanker, that are not so sophisticated.

[Phillip Miller]

John, I used to moan about the weekly lifeboat drill, but, in the back of my mind I always knew what was required of me and one day it may stand me in good stead. What does stick in my gullet is the amount of foreign flag ships where I'm sure lifeboat drill and safety training are neither here nor there, plus, do they all have an annual dry dock?

[Ivan Cloherty]

John, I used to moan about the weekly lifeboat drill, but, in the back of my mind I always knew what was required of me and one day it may stand me in good stead. What does stick in my gullet is the amount of foreign flag ships where I'm sure lifeboat drill and safety training are neither here nor there, plus, do they all have an annual dry dock?

Philip, I don't know about now, but in the 70's I used to manage a few foreign flagged ships and they were subject to the same survey rules as those of the UK flag, the rules being made by the various Classification Societies whether they be LR, BV, AB, NV etc etc which made them subject to annual drydocking surveys at that time. Lifeboat drills whether they be UK flag or any other were subject then, as they are now, to how the Master operated the ship or the Marine Supts kept an eye on things, although in all cases weekly drills were supposed to be carried out and entered in the log book, but we all know rules were flouted by some at sea. LSA (Life Saving Appliance) surveys were also compulsory (included lifeboats) every year and boat(s) swung out, what the official procedure is now I do not know, but there are those aboard this vessel who have recent sea experience can tell you.

Annual drydockings are no longer compulsory for some vessels as a lot depends on the underwater paint systems they are using in their anti-fouling methods, with some modern paints being self polishing and good for five years service,(the hull is usually surveyed by a Classification surveyor prior to dock flooding) therefore annual surveys can be carried out by Classification approved divers who inspect the paint, anodes and sea openings, rudders and pintles (if fitted), as far as I am aware the four year special survey rules still apply where ships must be drydocked.

Machinery on ships was (and may still be) subject to CSM (Continuous Machinery Survey) rules with some machinery (emergency fire pump etc) subject to annual survey and others bi-annual survey, Classification Societies gave some leeway to non essential machinery (Spare generators etc) if it was not up to scratch on the survey, with a proviso that it must be fixed within a certain time period (usually six months) otherwise the vessel may lose its classification, thus making any insurance void, the machinery had to be presented to a Classification period within that grace period, although that was not always possible on some tramping runs and the Society would be advised and an extension issued until the next port where a surveyor was available.

[John Arton]

Under the SOLAS 74 Convention the following certificates are required for a cargo ship to operate

Passenger Ship Safety Certificate

Cargo Ship Safety Construction Certificate
Cargo Ship Safety Equipment Certificate
Cargo Ship Safety Radio Certificate
Safety Management Certificate
Document of Compliance
additionally
Certificate of Fitness for the carriage of dangerous chemicals in bulk and also for the carriage of Liquid Gases in Bulk as appropriate.
Al these certificates are valid for a period of 5 years subject to an annual inspection by either flag or classification society surveyors.
The classification societies CSM runs for a 5 year period and is subject to an annual inspection.
Nowadays the CSM is usually a computerised system that records maintenance/inspection of all items on board the vessel as listed in the "Master List of Equipment". There are a number of commercial computerised maintenance systems available and some can even generate purchase orders for spares as and when they are required, think AMOS as being one of the biggest. These systems all depend on the Classification societies Master |List along with the equipment manufacturers recommended maintenance guidelines but can be amended by H.O. when experience shows that certain maintenance periods can be extended by, for instance, using special lubricating oils for machinery.
Most classification societies will allow Chief Engineers with sufficient experience to survey certain items such as pumps, purifiers etc, but any parts replaced must be kept for the classification society surveyor to inspect at the next annual survey and the CSM records must be up to date and often they will require photographic evidence.
Additionally such items as the ECDIS and VDR recorders will often need surveying by manufacturers annually.
The Cargo Ship Safety Radio Cert. needs to be done annually by a certified Radio Surveyor and most LSA and FFA need to have a maintenance certificate provided by a suitably qualified company annually in order for the Safety Certificate to remain valid.
rgds
JA

[j.sabourn]

Boat and fire musters were a sure way of seeing there was no one missing on the ship. The old boat system the compass in the boat was very useful for testing the de-gaussing if you had which was supposed to be tested frequently also. As regards lifeboats as far as I was concerned the best lifeboat was the ship you were on, and was usually only in an act of war, or stupidity, and as a last resort went to the boats. I would imagine launching a boat full of passengers would be very dangerous under even ideal weather conditions. I was employed launching small craft on a daily basis for a couple of years, the most dangerous times are the launching and recovery, if it was only for training periods I wouldnt go above a force 6. These boats were manned by experienced men who knew what they were doing, also the launching and recovery systems on some vessels left a lot to be desired. Ships lifeboats what I see from a distance on some of these passenger vessels, is hard to imagine them being launched with an untrained crew with a possible 100 elderly people on board, and in bad weather. Boatwork if done correctly is an acquired skill and is done through experience and correspondence between the ship and boat to hit the water at the right time. Timing is essential in bad weather, unfortuanetly it may of been the bad weather why you are abandoning the ship. If ship not sinking would rather stay put myself until knew definetly she was going, there again depending on weather conditions re the passengers and supernumeries on board would probably like to see them away at a slower pace that it would take for them. JS

[happy daze john in oz]

With all cruise ships of today the life boats are often used as tenders to take passengers ashore when anchored off. From my observations the crew are very adept at managing the craft. Emergency drill is carried out every week on most of them, usualy in port. With Princess cruise each ship goes in every two years for a cut and polish, very often in singapore, thye have some of the best facilities there of any country.Have no idea about cargo ships though did see a a car transporter dry docked for inspection in Leam Chabang.

[j.sabourn]

#6... I have no experience with passenger ships John, imagine however on the larger liners they embark on the boats through the ships side, which would certainly assist in an evacuation process, however all depends I suppose on the ship being upright. Having boat drills in port apart from showing people how everything works is ok, but would not prepare them for what it would be like in a real out of the way situation, taking the two recent examples of the eye tie, and the S Korean vessel. Has there been no further info. on the Costa Concordia so called villains. JS

[happy daze john in oz]

I think with modern cruise ships providing you do not have a captain like the Costa Concordia the chance of getting off in one piece is good. The biggest danger is I believe fire on board, but again the fire prevention system now is as good as you can get. Rough seas could and would cause concern, but on normal seas I think it would be OK.

[j.sabourn]

I assume in all this discussion on lifeboats, and for those ships still floating around that haven't reached the super-ship era, that the old lifeboat with sails, that they are still red in colour and marked with the first and last letter of the ships name, and the number of the boat, starting 1 starboard 2 port 3 starboard 4 port and henceforth all the way through. Also the sails are still the standing lug and jib. Cheers JS

[happy daze john in oz]

I assume in all this discussion on lifeboats, and for those ships still floating around that haven't reached the super-ship era, that the old lifeboat with sails, that they are still red in colour and marked with the first and last letter of the ships name, and the number of the boat, starting 1 starboard 2 port 3 starboard 4 port and henceforth all the way through. Also the sails are still the standing lug and jib. Cheers JS

Geez John you are a bit out of touch the crew on modern ships would not even know what a sail was. Life boats now must carry enough fuel to keep them sailing at 4 knots for 24 hours