Understanding a seamans identity document

[Errol Chandler]

Can anyone assist me in understanding my late fathers Seaman's Identity Certificate.
It is numbered 383619.
His name on the documents is given as follows:
Surname: Leary-Chandler
Christian Names: Basil Clement Leeke
Date of birth: June 4th 1893, Mold Nth Wales.
Height 5 . 5
Hair Brn. Eyes Grey.
Tatoo marks (blank)
Dis. A No. 61123
Next of Kin: Mrs J C Chandler
8 Burton House, Myatts Park, London.

Then his photograph and a list of 6 digit numbers which I now know are ships registered numbers:
13513 followed by date 16.12.18
24.12.19 still serving (I presume he remained on that ship for a year)
108357 date --.8.20
129074 --.10.20
112713 --.12.20
129074 --.5.21
118433 --,10.21
(most of the above were Union Castle ships. I know for a fact that he stayed with Union Castle for quite a few years more than recorded on the document, before settling in East London, South Africa and marrying my mother....who he met on the Winchester Castle when she was a passenger.
I query if he was issued with a new card after 1921? If so why is it not being found in the records?

Another thing that really puzzles the family is that his birth certificate records his name as:
Clement Leslie Chandler.
We cannot understand where all the extra names came from. They mean nothing at all to anyone in the family. Using combinations of these names has not helped in uncovering any documents that may have been issued after the one I have abruptly ended in 1921....that final vessel was the Kenilworth Castle.

I know it is pretty ancient history, but still interesting and intriguing to find out his movements.

I also know that he was at sea in 1911. But with what line is not known.
We understand that he was torpedoed twice early in the 1st WW and in both events his ship went down.
Then he disappears for about 3-4 years and the next we know is that he turns up in Russia as the revolution starts.....and is involved in a mission to rescue British diplomats from Vladivostok. Presumably he was an interpreter in the employ of the British government (As a young boy he was in Russia and attended the International School in Kiev and became fluent in Russian. He was in Russia because his father was working there for the Singer Sewing Machine Co.

A long shot! But maybe someone can cast some light?

[Tony Morcom]

Hi Errol

Welcome to the site and I hope you get all the information and help you need to try and trace your late father's movements.
In the mean time what I can tell you is the following and have enclosed some photos. There is a wealth of info about these ships on the web:
108357 SS Carisbrook Castle 7626 gross tons built 1898 scrapped 1922
129074 SS Balmoral Castle 13361 gross tons built 1910 scrapped 1939
112713 SS Saxon 12385 gross tons built 1899 scrapped 1935
118433 SS Arundel Castle 19023 gross tons built 1919 scrapped 1959

As yet I have been unable to track down 13513 May be one of our history experts will be able to assist with that and they will be able to try and help with the records.

Bearing in mind things were hand written in those days I can quite see how Leslie may have ended up as Leeke but the Basil bit is less easy to explain. Hope all this helps in some way.

[Errol Chandler]

Thank you for that and for the pictures.
My apologies, I typed 13513 instead of 135315:
the Llanstephan Castle, built in 1914.

I can quite see the mistake with Leslie becoming Leeke....but the real puzzle is the adding of Leary to the surname! It is a name which does not figure anywhere at all in the family history.
I had identified 108357 as a vessel called Kiukiang, built 1898. I checked my source again and 108357 is definitely listed as Kiukian....however 108351 is the Carisbrook Castle. The writing on the document seems pretty clear as a " 7 " but could be an error....and as all the others are Union Castle I think it must be 108351 Carisbrook.
(On such mis-information one is lead away down blind alleys!)
My source, which you are probably familiar with, for matching ships numbers to vessels is at:
Header

Can you enlighten me as to what: Dis. A No. 61123 indicates and if that number is a document that can be sourced somewhere?

When I say that mistakes can lead you down blind alleys, yes that is so...but on the other hand an error made 100 years ago can be a great way of finding out more....I.e. While searching my father's history I found him on the 1901 census as a 7 year old. 10years later he was on recorded, although the rest of the family were. Then I noticed that on the census form his father had filled in all the children's name, including my Dad, Clement Leslie....but that name was not found in the search. Then I saw that the on the census form the officials had crossed it off and written "At Sea" against it....so it was not put into the census record.....but that error placed him "At SEA" in 1911, so another small gap was filled! There is more about him in 1910 when he had just less than 6 months in the RN Boys Service before going awol for 15 months! I have his service record showing that! So they kicked him out of the RN and he must have runaway to sea and was not found for 15 months!

[Tony Morcom]

108357 is listed by the National Archives as being the Carisbrook Castle which is how I found it.

The Dis A number is your late father's Seaman's Discharge Book Number. This is his official record of time served at sea. The number is unique to him and he would have carried it so that entries could be made every time he signed on or paid off a ship.

135315 was the SS Llanstephan Castle which I assume that you have already identified.

Could he have been married before and adopted her name as a double barrelled surname?? Or maybe he was just trying to disguise his name as he had been awol from the RN?? Possibly a mystery that won't ever actually get solved. Good luck anyway.

[Errol Chandler]

Thank you. I will let you know how I progress the research.
As he was caught in 1912 and punished (I assume) and the identity document was only started in 1918 with a World War in between I think there may be more to this than meets the eye!

[Lou Barron]

Hi TONY the picture of the ARUNDEL castle look a lot different to the one i was in convoy withduring the war

[Doc Vernon]

Hi Louis
Had a conversion a bit later!
See this Link for a wee bit of info!
Cheers

RMS. ARUNDEL CASTLE

[Doc Vernon]

Hi Errol
Dont know if this may help at all ??
Just trying to assist!
Cheers

Merchant Seamen - general

[Ivan Cloherty]

Hi Errol
Dont know if this may help at all ??
Just trying to assist!
Cheers

Merchant Seamen - general

Very useful that Doc, especially as you can download a PDF version, it all helps.

The amount of guidance received on this site is incredible and a credit to all who supply it and you can be assured is appreciated.

[Tony Morcom]

[QUOTE=Ivan Cloherty;76142]Very useful that Doc, especially as you can download a PDF version, it all helps.

Forgive me being a little slow this morning Ivan but how do you download it as a PDF?