This article will make your blood boil

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Originally Posted by Roger DYER

Ivan and Shipmates,

Please accept my apologies if my post #112 appeared a bit 'over the top'.
Ivan, you have indicated a willingness to write to the Elder Brethren of Trinity House on our behalf and I, for one, welcome your your kind offer. In the circumstances I can think of no other member better suited for the task. Before proceeding, may I suggest that, as a matter of common courtesy, we seek the approval of Brian (Probetts) and, perhaps, allow a day or so for any members to voice their objections to this proposal should they wish to do so.

...........................best regards to all, Roger.

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Roger

Your post was not over the top, as we all feel the same, we were all "disappointed" that Trinity House seemed to be allowing what we ordinary seamen thought of as desecration of our seafarers only known grave. It may not have been their intention but it certainly came across that way. They have of course like any other commercial enterprise to think of new ways of raising revenue to continue their good work and we understand that. They have a beautiful building which is probably under utilised and an in-depth study of their website will show this, but partying in the gardens should be taboo.

I do have a great respect for Trinity House, as I am a product of Hull Trinity House so I as much as any was affected by this insensitivity and disappointed by the apparent lack of respect for fellows of our calling. We must assume that the person or persons who are responsible for the marketing are not seafarers so are understandably not aware of the closeness of all ranks of our calling when our service is disrespected in this way. However the permission for these events must have been signed-off by the Board who are all ex seafarers, all-be-it for some reason most are ex Royal Navy so I do think an explanation is due to us.

If anyone wants to take up the cudgeol then of course they may, but I think a decision must be taken by Friday (UK Time) as we cannot allow this to cool off, so that it becomes a non-issue in the eyes of the Trinity House Brethren and we receive a polite brush-off reply, because future years are at stake.

The CEO of The Corporation of Trinity House, known as Deputy Master is

Rear Admiral Sir Jeremy de Halpert KCVO CB FRIN (Deputy Master)

The Deputy Master Designate is

Captain Ian McNaught (deputy Master Desig) who it appears is a Merchant Navy man, so any letter sent to Sir Jeremy should be copied to Captain McNaught.

The Master of course is HRH Princess Anne

So one and all, the bullet has got to be bitten and a decision has to be taken and we would prefer to do it with Brian's blessing, as we are using his site to express our feelings and it would add strength to any letter if we were able to say we have the support of 6000 plus members

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Originally Posted by Ivan Cloherty

So one and all, the bullet has got to be bitten and a decision has to be taken and we would prefer to do it with Brian's blessing, as we are using his site to express our feelings and it would add strength to any letter if we were able to say we have the support of 6000 plus members

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Ivan, whilst your last was addressed to Roger, I have to say that I thoroughly agree. The disappointing thing though is that there has not been one word from either Brian or any of the moderators on this subject at any time as far as I can see. Maybe I am wrong, but if it is the case, then one has to wonder why?

Maybe' if you cannot get Brian's blessing allowing you to speak on behalf on 6000 members, you could at least write on behalf of those members who wish it and could add all our names. I will start the ball rolling with:
Tony Morcom : Houlder Bros & Co Ltd 1973 ~ 1980

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Originally Posted by TonyMorcom

Ivan, whilst your last was addressed to Roger, I have to say that I thoroughly agree. The disappointing thing though is that there has not been one word from either Brian or any of the moderators on this subject at any time as far as I can see. Maybe I am wrong, but if it is the case, then one has to wonder why?

Maybe' if you cannot get Brian's blessing allowing you to speak on behalf on 6000 members, you could at least write on behalf of those members who wish it and could add all our names. I will start the ball rolling with:
Tony Morcom : Houlder Bros & Co Ltd 1973 ~ 1980

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Tony/Roger thank you for your emails, in light of your support I have sent a PMessage to Brian with a copy of the proposed letter, requesting his permission to use the site as a reference. I know I may have jumped the gun and may not have the support of all or many on the site, but something has to be done before this dies a natural death, and I for one am not prepared to let this happen, our forebears made too many ultimate sacrifices.

If Brian does not feel it appropriate for the site to be mentioned and I would fully understand why, it may not be politic to do so, then I will write as a private individual and anyone who wants to support me can contact me on ivan@ijcinternational.com and their names can be added to the letter and they will be kept fully informed, naturally I would prefer Brian's support.

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Originally Posted by Ivan Cloherty

Tony/Roger thank you for your emails, in light of your support I have sent a PMessage to Brian with a copy of the proposed letter, requesting his permission to use the site as a reference. I know I may have jumped the gun and may not have the support of all or many on the site, but something has to be done before this dies a natural death, and I for one am not prepared to let this happen, our forebears made too many ultimate sacrifices.

If Brian does not feel it appropriate for the site to be mentioned and I would fully understand why, it may not be politic to do so, then I will write as a private individual and anyone who wants to support me can contact me on ivan@ijcinternational.com and their names can be added to the letter and they will be kept fully informed, naturally I would prefer Brian's support.

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My email is on its way Regards Terry.

Ivan,

Sent you a P.M. a short while ago with my details. Should you wish me to repeat that information vide an email please advise.

.................regards, Roger.

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Originally Posted by Roger DYER

Ivan,

Sent you a P.M. a short while ago with my details. Should you wish me to repeat that information vide an email please advise.

.................regards, Roger.

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Message safely received, appreciate it

Regards

Ivan

Just to let everyone know, Brian has given permission to use this site as a reference in the letter to Trinity House, I supplied Brian with a copy of the intended letter.

I therefore propose to waste no further time and the letter will be in this evenings mail to Sir Jeremy de Halpert

Regards

Ivan

Thank you Ivan and good luck with the letter.

Chris.

Well done Ivan. Good luck with your letter

This is a copy of a letter from Ivan Cloherty addressed to
Rear Admiral Sir Jeremy de Halpert KCVO CB FRIN

21st October 2011 Jasmine Cottage
9 Lisburne Square
Torquay TQ1 2PT

Rear Admiral Sir Jeremy de Halpert KCVO CB FRIN
The Corporation of Trinity House
Trinity House
Tower Hill
London EC3N 4DH

Dear Sir Jeremy
Merchant Navy Memorial Tower Hill
You will be aware about the disquiet raised about the proposed events which were to take place in a marquee on what we Merchant Navy personnel consider hallowed ground, the Memorial Gardens in Trinity Square. Arrangements were being made to hold Christmas parties with drink and discos between the dates of 17th November and 22nd December 2011 in the gardens next to the Memorials which record the deaths of nearly 35,000 Merchant Navy personnel of all creeds and colours who sacrificed their lives in two world wars and other conflicts.
I am writing on behalf of a Merchant Navy organisation with over 6500 members and complaints were received from members now living as far afield as Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Canada, the United States of America and of course the United Kingdom and Europe. Such was the depth of feeling against the proposed desecration of this hallowed ground our members were prepared to travel from far off shores to demonstrate against this proposed outrage.
We have contacted Trinity House previously by email and have received replies from your Public Relations department that Trinity House had no knowledge of these events, which contradicts an email received by me from Tower Hamlets Council, whom I had contacted earlier (copy attached).
We Merchant seamen would seek an assurance from Trinity House that this type of “partying” will not be considered in the future on our hallowed ground. We would seek that assurance from yourself or your deputy, but not from the Trinity House Public Relations Department or the Events Manager. We would seek an answer “Seaman to Seaman” from someone who knows what seamens camaraderie is, and not with all due respect, from someone who has completed a “Marketing and Public Relations Course” and probably has no idea how hurtful it would be to we seamen that others would be seen dancing on our comrades only known grave.
(2)
I do hope you will give this request some serious consideration, both to remember the dead and to uphold the esteem that we seamen hold for Trinity House which we have always considered a friend and benefactor of seamen.
I am a product of Hull Trinity House Navigation School which I attended in the period 1951 to 1954 our motto was, and still is “Spes Super Sydera”, Hope beyond the Stars, and I can only hope that you can understand the hurt the events would have caused and the hurt such future events would cause.
Of course we all realise that the Corporation needs to raise revenue to continue its good work to protect current seamen, all we ask is that the revenue raising does not infringe upon the memory and respect for those who made the ultimate sacrifice.
Yours faithfully


Ivan Cloherty
Discharge A Number R611450
Telephone 01803 211350
Email ivanjcloherty@hotmail.co.uk

c.c. Captain Ian McNaught (Deputy Master Desig)

encl: email from Tower Hamlets