researching Dads service from 1939 to the 1950's

[Andrea Gene Watson]

My father Frederick Douglas Charles Albones started his time in the Merchant Navy at the age of 16years, I believe on the Margalau, he then transfered to the British Energy from March 1940 until the July, when there appears to be a break of a number of months until the December, when he is listed on the British Industry from 1940 until 12th February 1941( all this information I have obtained through the National Archives, as he didn't talk about his war service, but he opened up a little when I married my husband a Royal Naval Officer, as they had familiar thing to talk about, my husband tells me dad was a DEMs gunner)
It was then on to the Empire Star from March 1941 until the end of May 1941 when he was recruited from the Merchant Navy pool and transfered to the Christian Holm until Aril 1942.
His next move was to the Regent Panther from the beginning of May until the beginning of October 1942. he then spent 3 weeks on the City of Pretoria.
This is where things get tricky, I cannot read the name of the next vessel, it's number is 169020, and it looks like Somp Colaridge, any ideas? he spent from the middle of November 1942 until the beginning of February 1943 when he was transfered to the Ubiquity for a few weeks and then on to the Bulan(which I understand was a cable ship where he remained until the beginning of October 1945 when he returned to the Ubiquity until his discharge in the February of 1946.
He remained at sea untl the early 1950's on the Trigonasemus, when he finally came ashore.
He married my mum in the December of 1945 while on shore leave, and in the wedding photo he is wearing Royal Naval uniform and has his ribbons, but To my knowledge he never had hs medals. This is one of the main reasons for the research, I would like to obtain his medals, he now has a greatgrand son, my great nephew, who is his namesake, and I think that when Douglas is older he would be able to attend Armistice Day and wear his greatgranddads medals.
If anyone can throw further light on this subject I would be most grateful.
Andrea Watson

[Doc Vernon]

Hello Andrea
That Ship is ( 169020 )

EMPIRE COLERIDGE

Sunderland, 15/1942 Steam, 9798 tons

Hope this helps

The following link may help you in finding out about how to apply for his Medals
Cheers
You mention Royal Navy Uniform, have you got his Papers from that, and if so what is his RN Number ?? Just Curious!

Apply for a medal or veterans badge : Apply for a medal - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Was he originally from Reading. His Discharge Number R214933. Cheers

Just for interest on his last Ship you mention

TRIGONOSEMUS | Helderline.com

[Hugh]

Hello Andrea and welcome,

I think we need to clear up a couple of things before you are advised of the path you need to go down to obtain his service medals. You mention RN uniform and DEMS which made me think he was a Royal Navy gunner serving on MN ships. However, Vernon asks the question if he was from Reading with Dis.A R214933? and this, if it is him, suggests to me he was a merchant seaman serving on T124 Agreements. This means he was actually a merchant seaman serving on Royal Navy ships effectively, Naval Auxiliary Personnel. BT 390/148/40 and that may determine where you need to go for medal entitlement.

I can see him joining TRIGONOSEMUS at Cardiff on 30.6.1950 he had 10 years service.

Regards
Hugh

[Andrea Gene Watson]

Thank you so much for your interest, so far from the information I have managed to obtain from the National Archives, there is nothing to show his RN number.
Yes he was from Reading, his dischrge number was R. 214993, and thanks also for the name Empire Coleridge (there was apparently a name change in 1942 to the Esso Cheyenne)
I find unearthing Dads navy past is intriguing, he sure moved around between vessels, and I am now searching the convoys he would have been part of.
I remember him being away, I was born in 1947 and he used to send me some lovely gifts from overseas, some of my favourites being a nursery popup book from America and clogs from Holland (painted yellow with red bows)
Again thank you for your help
Andrea

[Andrea Gene Watson]

Hello Hugh,
Yes he was from Reading, Dis.A No.R214993, also he was serving on T124 T Agreements. This information I have received from Kew, so where do I go from there?
I have done a lot of research in our family history, and rue the day that I didn't pay more attention to their lives when they were still alive, but then it's only as you get older that this type of thing becomes important, and by then it's too late!
Thank you Hugh for your help, this website is awsome.
Andrea

[Doc Vernon]

Name: Albones, Frederick Douglas . Service number: R214993 . Place of birth: Reading .... | The National Archives

As Hugh gives this link, which is one i did see (Sorry i forgot to add) just follow the leads, for his Documents.

Not sure as to the Medals application , as sounds like there may be somewhere else to look, according to what i read from Hugh ?? Or am i missing something ?

Hope though that you now will be able to fill in all the gaps and have full knowledge of your dear Dad!

Looks like the T24 Records hold some great info , example below. Good Luck
The Fourth Service: Cataloguing merchant seamen in the Second World War - The National Archives blog

[Hugh]

Hello Hugh,
Yes he was from Reading, DisA No. R214993, also he was serving on T124 T Agreements. This information I have received from Kew, so where do I go from there?

Hi Andrea,
OK, so he actually has three files at TNA Kew 2 x pouches and probably a CRS 10 - service record beginning January 1941 - until end of service. The CRS 10 will only show normal MN agreements including service post war. T124T will be in his BT 390 Pouch. I would suggest you also obtain that unless you already have it. It is held at Kew in piece BT 382/13
His Seaman's Pouch is held at Kew in piece BT 372/283/109
I don't know if you have this file or not?

His T124 Pouch for service on Royal Navy ships is held at Kew in piece BT 390/148/40 Do you have this file?

My thoughts:

He served in the Merchant Navy and has a Dis.A number rather than any Royal Navy service number so definitely not Royal Navy or a DEMS gunner. However, that said, he was definitely Naval Auxiliary Personnel for some of his time effectively under the orders and discipline of the Royal Navy while signed on to this Agreement. That may have been one or more ships but you won't know until you obtain and look at BT 390 from Kew.

Vernon (Doc) said:

Not sure as to the Medals application as sounds like there may be somewhere else to look, according to what I read from Hugh ?? Or am i missing something ?

Not missing anything really Vernon as the T124 Agreement falls in between both the MN and the RN and there would probably need to be some collaboration between them to assess his full medal entitlement. I am sure the Pouch in BT 390 will show which ship or ships he served in but we would also need to know where those ships served to be able to assess his full entitlement.

My advice would be to firstly make sure you obtain all of the files mentioned unless of course you have his Discharge Books and then make a medal application to the Registry of Shipping and Seamen now called the Maritime Coastguard Agency (MCA) in Cardiff.

The Maritime and Coastguard Agency
MCA Cardiff, Anchor Court, Keen Road, Cardiff CF24 5JW
Sorry, I don't have an up-to-date phone number for them.

You should contact them in the first instance but be aware you will need to supply evidence of service which preferably should be more than the pouches as they are not full-service records.
Evidence would be any surviving Discharge Book or CRS 10 [which is held in BT 382) his CRS 10 will show details of any service on normal MN Articles of Agreement which is important for full medal entitlement. You will also need Movement Cards for all the ships. The application will need to in the name of his next of kin and also include a copy of his death certificate.

Looking again at what you have said in your first post, I guess he was serving on T124 from 1943 - until the end of the war. HMS UBIQUITY (cable ship depot, Trinity Road, Edinburgh) HMS BULAN was a cable ship operated under T124 Agreements.

Seems a lot but we can help you in the process if we know firstly what you have and what you don't have in the way of documentation.

Regards
Hugh

[Doc Vernon]

Good info and findings Hugh.
Hope that the Lady will follow up on all info given.
Cheers

[Des Taff Jenkins]

Andrea.
Just something I found in my book of British ships sinking's of the 2nd world war, your Dad was lucky he left the Empire Star, as it was sunk by a U boat on the 23rd Oct 1942. A young lad from our village who joined the MN with my brother was on his first voyage at 16 when the Empire Star went down
Des