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Thread: Long Tan

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    Default Long Tan

    As many Australians will have noticed by the media reports that the yearly pilgrimage to Long Tan to honour the victims of the fiercest battle fought in Vietnam and was usually kept low key to honour those lost on both sides has been cancelled at short notice, this rings a bell to a similar attitude of certain parties in Europe who would rewrite History. My answer to the situation is for those who are so keen to holiday in Vietnam would be to choose a different destination to spend their money. This month is the 50th anniversary. JWS

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    John, look at it from both sides. The Australians just want to honor those who fell, but for the Vietnamese it brings back memories of a very humbling defeat.

    But unlike many in EU they do not try to erase it from their history.

    having been there and seen some of the war zones and old film footage taken at the time by the Viet Kong it is interesting to note that the war was more a situation of Russia, supplying one side, and USA the other fighting each other for control of the region.
    Happy daze John in Oz.

    Life is too short to blend in.

    John Strange R737787
    World Traveller

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    You see Vietnam through a tourists eyes. The Australian troops who died there were mostly not volunteers but conscripted. Reading and listening to Australians who were actually were there, they were scorned by their own people when they returned. It is the politicians who should be scorned. I know at least a couple today who have more bad feelings towards their own people than to the people they were told were the enemy. It was the usual war started by different attitudes to politics. The Turkish government accept the usual rituals for those departed, why not Vietnam, they won the war in any case regardless of all the slaver otherwise. JWS

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    Quote Originally Posted by happy daze john in oz View Post

    having been there and seen some of the war zones and old film footage taken at the time by the Viet Kong it is interesting to note that the war was more a situation of Russia, supplying one side, and USA the other fighting each other for control of the region.
    Very much like Syria today ...............................
    When one door closes another one shuts, it must be the wind

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    Viet Nam has fought for its independence for over 2,000 years, the French, USA and the Australians had No Right to be there, it was just Politicians, who never go to war, who send other Mothers sons to fight and die for a stupid war that no one wants.
    I have been to Viet Nam as a Tourist and found them to be a very friendly people. Who are fed up of constantly being fought over.
    I also helped to evacuate the French Foreign Legion after the Defeat of the French at Dien Bien Phu on the good ship GEORGIC..
    .

    .Here is the History of Viet Nam, basically two nations , North and South that the west want to control............................
    .
    A BRIEF HISTORY OF VIETNAM
    By Tim Lambert

    Ancient Vietnam


    About 2,000 years ago people in North Vietnam began growing rice in the Red River Valley. To irrigate their crops they built dykes and dug canals. They were forced to work together and so an organised kingdom emerged called Van Lang. However in the 2nd century BC the Chinese conquered the area.

    The Chinese ruled northern Vietnam for more than 1,000 years and Chinese civilization had a great impact on the Vietnamese.

    However in South Vietnam there was Indian influence. From the 1st century to the 6th century AD the southernmost part of Vietnam was part of a state called Funan.

    In the middle of Vietnam an Indian influenced state called Champa arose in the 2nd century AD.

    In North Vietnam the people resented Chinese rule and in 40 AD the Trung sisters led a rebellion. They formed an independent state. However in 43 AD the Chinese crushed the rebellion and the sisters killed themselves. The Chinese continued to rule North Vietnam until the 10th century. Finally in 938 a leader named Ngo Quyen defeated the Chinese at the battle of Bach Dang River and North Vietnam became an independent state.

    In the 13th century the Mongols invaded Vietnam three times. In 1257 and 1284 they captured the capital but each time they soon withdrew. Then in 1288 the Vietnamese leader Tran Hung Dao routed the Mongols at the Bach Dang River.

    However in the early 15th century China tried to regain control of North Vietnam. In 1407 they occupied the country but their rule was resisted. In 1418 Le Loi began the Lam Son Uprising. By 1428 the Chinese were driven out and Le Loi became the Emperor Le Thai To. Under his successors the central Vietnamese state of Champa became a vassal state of North Vietnam.

    However in the early 16th century the power of the Le dynasty declined. During the 17th and 18th centuries two rival families effectively held power, the Trinh in the north and the Nguyen in the south. The Nguyen family conquered the Mekong Delta from the Khmer Empire.

    In the 1770s a rebellion began in the town of Tay Son. Three brothers called Nguyen led it. Gradually they took territory from the Nguyen lords in the south and the Trinh lords in the north. By 1786 they were in control of the whole of Vietnam and one brother, Nguyen Hue made himself Emperor Quang Trung. In 1788 the Chinese intervened in Vietnam but the Vietnamese routed them at Dong Da.

    However a Nguyen lord named Nguyen Anh escaped. He raised an army and from 1789 he pushed back the rebels. Nguyen Anh took Hanoi in 1802 and made himself Emperor Gia Long. Under him Vietnam became a strong united kingdom.

    Meanwhile the Portuguese reached Vietnam by sea in 1516. In their wake came missionaries, first Dominicans then Jesuits and the Roman Catholic Church made some headway in Vietnam.

    The French in Vietnam

    In the late 19th century Vietnam became a French colony. However the French took over Vietnam in stages. In 1859 they captured Saigon. Finally in 1883 North and Central Vietnam was forced to become a French protectorate.

    The French built infrastructure in Vietnam such as the Saigon to Hanoi railway. They also built roads and bridges. However the building was funded by heavy taxation. Naturally the Vietnamese wanted independence. The Communists spearheaded the struggle for independence. Ho Chi Minh founded the Revolutionary Youth League from the safety of China in 1925. In 1930 it became the Vietnamese Communist party.

    In 1940 the Germans defeated France. Japan decided to take advantage of French weakness and they forced the French government to allow Japanese troops to occupy French Indo-China, although they left the French administration in place.

    The Vietnamese Communists or Viet Minh fought the Japanese and by 1945 they controlled parts of North Vietnam. Meanwhile in March 1945 the Japanese took control of the administration of Vietnam and when Japan surrendered on 15 August 1945 they left a power vacuum.

    Ho Chi Minh moved quickly to fill the vacuum. He called for an uprising called the August Revolution and the Viet Minh took control of most of Vietnam. On 2 September 1945 Ho Chi Minh declared Vietnam independent.

    However the great powers ignored the Vietnamese demand for independence. Under the terms of the Potsdam Conference Japanese troops south of the 16th parallel surrendered to the British. Those to the north surrendered to the Nationalist Chinese.

    However the French army soon arrived in the south to take control from the British. In the north Chinese troops moved in. However Ho Chi Minh soon decided that the French were the lesser of two evils and he signed a treaty, which said that French troops should replace Chinese troops in North Vietnam for 5 years. In return the French promised to recognized Vietnam as a 'free state'.

    However it soon became clear the French had no intention of giving up power in Vietnam and fighting broke out between them and the Viet Minh.

    For eight years the Viet Minh fought a guerrilla war against the French. Finally in 1954 they surrounded a French army at Dien Bien Phu. After a siege lasting 57 days the French were forced to surrender. By then it was clear that the French could not win the war and both sides met at the Geneva Conference to end the war. They agreed that Vietnam would be temporarily divided at the 17th parallel and elections would be held by 20 July 1956. However no elections were held and the division of Vietnam became permanent.

    Modern Vietnam

    In the north Ho Chi Minh introduced a Communist regime while in the south Ngo Dinh Diem became ruler. However in the early 1960s South Vietnam was rocked by demonstrations and in 1963 Diem was ousted in a coup.

    Meanwhile in 1959 the North Vietnamese began a long guerrilla war to reunite Vietnam under Communist rule. The Northern Guerrillas were known as the Vietcong.

    Gradually the USA became involved in the Vietnam War. As early as 1950 the US sent military advisers to South Vietnam. Financially they supported the French and later the South Vietnamese government.

    Then in 1964 two US ships were supposedly subject to 'unprovoked' attacks by the North Vietnamese. First the Maddox was attacked. Two days later the Maddox and a ship called the C Turner Joy claimed they were both attacked. (It is doubtful if this attack ever took place).

    The Americans then bombed the north and Congress passed the Tonkin Gulf Resolution allowing the president to take 'all necessary measures' to prevent 'further aggression'. As a result by December 1965 there were 183,000 US soldiers in Vietnam and by the end of 1967 there were nearly half a million. However the Vietcong continued their guerrilla war.

    In January 1968 the Vietcong launched the Tet offensive in towns and cities across South Vietnam. They suffered heavy losses but afterwards the Americans gradually withdrew from Vietnam. In January 1973 they signed a ceasefire and the remaining American troops withdrew.

    The South Vietnamese continued to fight the Vietcong alone. However in the early months of 1975 South Vietnamese resistance collapsed and on 30 April 1975 the North Vietnamese captured Saigon. Vietnam was reunited under Communist rule.

    Then in the late 1970s the Khmer Rouge made attacks on Vietnam. So in 1978 the Vietnamese occupied Cambodia. They stayed until 1989.

    Meanwhile in 1986 the Vietnamese government introduced market reforms. As a result the Vietnamese economy began to grow rapidly. In 1994 the USA lifted an economic embargo on Vietnam and in 1995 diplomatic relations were restored.

    Today the Vietnamese economy is booming and Vietnam is becoming more and more prosperous. Tourism is an important industry in Vietnam. Furthermore a stock exchange opened in Vietnam in 2000.

    Today the population of Vietnam is 94 million.
    Last edited by Captain Kong; 18th August 2016 at 09:59 AM.

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    I will agree there with you Brian about them being friendly people and hard working as well. Have a nephew who has worked up there since 1983 and loves it.

    If you look beyond the tourist spots you will find the real Vietnam and it is there you will find any amount of info regarding the war of the 60's. How the women dug most of the tunnels whilst the men were fighting, how some were as deep as nine meters to avoid damage caused by bombing. How they made shoes from vehicle tyres and fished at night so the 'enemy' would not see them. A very resourceful people indeed.
    Happy daze John in Oz.

    Life is too short to blend in.

    John Strange R737787
    World Traveller

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    Default Re: Long Tan

    [QUOTE=Captain Kong;238458]Viet Nam has fought for its independence for over 2,000 years, the French, USA and the Australians had No Right to be there, it was just Politicians, who never go to war, who send other Mothers sons to fight and die for a stupid war that no one wants.
    I have been to Viet Nam as a Tourist and found them to be a very friendly people. Who are fed up of constantly being fought over.
    I also helped to evacuate the French Foreign Legion after the Defeat of the French at Dien Bien Phu on the good ship GEORGIC..
    .

    .Here is the History of Viet Nam, basically two nations , North and South that the west want to control............................
    .
    A BRIEF HISTORY OF VIETNAM
    By Tim Lambert

    Ancient Vietnam


    About 2,000 years ago people in North Vietnam began growing rice in the Red River Valley. To irrigate their crops they built dykes and dug canals. They were forced to work together and so an organised kingdom emerged called Van Lang. However in the 2nd century BC the Chinese conquered the area.

    The Chinese ruled northern Vietnam for more than 1,000 years and Chinese civilization had a great impact on the Vietnamese.

    However in South Vietnam there was Indian influence. From the 1st century to the 6th century AD the southernmost part of Vietnam was part of a state called Funan.

    In the middle of Vietnam an Indian influenced state called Champa arose in the 2nd century AD.

    In North Vietnam the people resented Chinese rule and in 40 AD the Trung sisters led a rebellion. They formed an independent state. However in 43 AD the Chinese crushed the rebellion and the sisters killed themselves. The Chinese continued to rule North Vietnam until the 10th century. Finally in 938 a leader named Ngo Quyen defeated the Chinese at the battle of Bach Dang River and North Vietnam became an independent state.

    In the 13th century the Mongols invaded Vietnam three times. In 1257 and 1284 they captured the capital but each time they soon withdrew. Then in 1288 the Vietnamese leader Tran Hung Dao routed the Mongols at the Bach Dang River.

    However in the early 15th century China tried to regain control of North Vietnam. In 1407 they occupied the country but their rule was resisted. In 1418 Le Loi began the Lam Son Uprising. By 1428 the Chinese were driven out and Le Loi became the Emperor Le Thai To. Under his successors the central Vietnamese state of Champa became a vassal state of North Vietnam.

    However in the early 16th century the power of the Le dynasty declined. During the 17th and 18th centuries two rival families effectively held power, the Trinh in the north and the Nguyen in the south. The Nguyen family conquered the Mekong Delta from the Khmer Empire.

    In the 1770s a rebellion began in the town of Tay Son. Three brothers called Nguyen led it. Gradually they took territory from the Nguyen lords in the south and the Trinh lords in the north. By 1786 they were in control of the whole of Vietnam and one brother, Nguyen Hue made himself Emperor Quang Trung. In 1788 the Chinese intervened in Vietnam but the Vietnamese routed them at Dong Da.

    However a Nguyen lord named Nguyen Anh escaped. He raised an army and from 1789 he pushed back the rebels. Nguyen Anh took Hanoi in 1802 and made himself Emperor Gia Long. Under him Vietnam became a strong united kingdom.

    Meanwhile the Portuguese reached Vietnam by sea in 1516. In their wake came missionaries, first Dominicans then Jesuits and the Roman Catholic Church made some headway in Vietnam.

    The French in Vietnam

    In the late 19th century Vietnam became a French colony. However the French took over Vietnam in stages. In 1859 they captured Saigon. Finally in 1883 North and Central Vietnam was forced to become a French protectorate.

    The French built infrastructure in Vietnam such as the Saigon to Hanoi railway. They also built roads and bridges. However the building was funded by heavy taxation. Naturally the Vietnamese wanted independence. The Communists spearheaded the struggle for independence. Ho Chi Minh founded the Revolutionary Youth League from the safety of China in 1925. In 1930 it became the Vietnamese Communist party.

    In 1940 the Germans defeated France. Japan decided to take advantage of French weakness and they forced the French government to allow Japanese troops to occupy French Indo-China, although they left the French administration in place.

    The Vietnamese Communists or Viet Minh fought the Japanese and by 1945 they controlled parts of North Vietnam. Meanwhile in March 1945 the Japanese took control of the administration of Vietnam and when Japan surrendered on 15 August 1945 they left a power vacuum.

    Ho Chi Minh moved quickly to fill the vacuum. He called for an uprising called the August Revolution and the Viet Minh took control of most of Vietnam. On 2 September 1945 Ho Chi Minh declared Vietnam independent.

    However the great powers ignored the Vietnamese demand for independence. Under the terms of the Potsdam Conference Japanese troops south of the 16th parallel surrendered to the British. Those to the north surrendered to the Nationalist Chinese.

    However the French army soon arrived in the south to take control from the British. In the north Chinese troops moved in. However Ho Chi Minh soon decided that the French were the lesser of two evils and he signed a treaty, which said that French troops should replace Chinese troops in North Vietnam for 5 years. In return the French promised to recognized Vietnam as a 'free state'.

    However it soon became clear the French had no intention of giving up power in Vietnam and fighting broke out between them and the Viet Minh.

    For eight years the Viet Minh fought a guerrilla war against the French. Finally in 1954 they surrounded a French army at Dien Bien Phu. After a siege lasting 57 days the French were forced to surrender. By then it was clear that the French could not win the war and both sides met at the Geneva Conference to end the war. They agreed that Vietnam would be temporarily divided at the 17th parallel and elections would be held by 20 July 1956. However no elections were held and the division of Vietnam became permanent.

    Modern Vietnam

    In the north Ho Chi Minh introduced a Communist regime while in the south Ngo Dinh Diem became ruler. However in the early 1960s South Vietnam was rocked by demonstrations and in 1963 Diem was ousted in a coup.

    Meanwhile in 1959 the North Vietnamese began a long guerrilla war to reunite Vietnam under Communist rule. The Northern Guerrillas were known as the Vietcong.

    Gradually the USA became involved in the Vietnam War. As early as 1950 the US sent military advisers to South Vietnam. Financially they supported the French and later the South Vietnamese government.

    Then in 1964 two US ships were supposedly subject to 'unprovoked' attacks by the North Vietnamese. First the Maddox was attacked. Two days later the Maddox and a ship called the C Turner Joy claimed they were both attacked. (It is doubtful if this attack ever took place).

    The Americans then bombed the north and Congress passed the Tonkin Gulf Resolution allowing the president to take 'all necessary measures' to prevent 'further aggression'. As a result by December 1965 there were 183,000 US soldiers in Vietnam and by the end of 1967 there were nearly half a million. However the Vietcong continued their guerrilla war.

    In January 1968 the Vietcong launched the Tet offensive in towns and cities across South Vietnam. They suffered heavy losses but afterwards the Americans gradually withdrew from Vietnam. In January 1973 they signed a ceasefire and the remaining American troops withdrew.

    The South Vietnamese continued to fight the Vietcong alone. However in the early months of 1975 South Vietnamese resistance collapsed and on 30 April 1975 the North Vietnamese captured Saigon. Vietnam was reunited under Communist rule.

    Then in the late 1970s the Khmer Rouge made attacks on Vietnam. So in 1978 the Vietnamese occupied Cambodia. They stayed until 1989.

    Meanwhile in 1986 the Vietnamese government introduced market reforms. As a result the Vietnamese economy began to grow rapidly. In 1994 the USA lifted an economic embargo on Vietnam and in 1995 diplomatic relations were restored.

    Today the Vietnamese economy is booming and Vietnam is becoming more and more prosperous. Tourism is an important industry in Vietnam. Furthermore a stock exchange opened in Vietnam in 2000.

    Today the population of Vietnam is 94 million.
    There is a lot more to the history of the Vietnam War than a quick Copy and Paste of the history can show, like the member who very rarely writes the Oil Platform Disaster most of what I know is to painful to remember. It wasn't until I visited the Vietnam Memorial did I get any closure.

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  14. #8
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    Default Re: Long Tan

    Only a crowd of civilians
    From every walk of life
    We left our homes and loved ones
    For we felt it our duty to fight

    We think of our wives and sweethearts
    Back on our sunny shores
    We think of the boys who could help us
    Bring victory to the cause

    But we carry on midst the dust and the heat
    Not that we want to but know that we must
    It's square your shoulders and pick up your pack
    For the sooner it's over the sooner we're back.


    published in the 2/48 battalion news sheet 1941
    Happy daze John in Oz.

    Life is too short to blend in.

    John Strange R737787
    World Traveller

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