Women to serve on Submarines??

[Jacyn Wade]

No, no wrist slapping intended at all and no offense taken whatsoever, Tony. Just me offering up another perspective... and trying to keep up the ladies' end of things.

[Captain Kong]

Imagine what would happen if the Lady Commander got a `Dear Joan` letter from her husband who had run off with the Nanny while she was away for months,
She could type in the Lat and Long of their position and Zap a missile at them.

[happy daze john in oz]

No, no wrist slapping intended at all and no offense taken whatsoever, Tony. Just me offering up another perspective... and trying to keep up the ladies' end of things.

Thought keeping the end up was the man's job?

[happy daze john in oz]

Can't necessarily disagree with you too much there, Tony, except I would think if they've achieved that level of rank, they've probably already got a pretty good handle on their emotions at the time of the month in question. I wouldn't think one would last too long in any type of military or equally serious service if one was completely erratic for 5 to 7 days every month!

We have a PM who is erratic, certainly not errotic, 24/7

[Jacyn Wade]

Keeping one's end up all depends on the point of view, doesn't it John? And it's probably best if I leave it at that...

[Keith Tindell]

Hi All,
A thought has just struck me while watching *Antiques Roadshow* on TV here in Uk, and introduced a woman who had Ernest Shackleton`s first aid kit, this had been used to amputate one of Shackletons crews toes . The aside to the story was that this woman had trekked to the pole on an expedition, and had amputated her own toes without anesthetic !!!, and this coming year intends to be the first women to trek to the North pole on her own, so there are some tough cookies out there, and with her ability to amputate* things*, i will refrain from any sexist comment!!!. So i suspect that this submariner female will be very capable, regards to all

[Captain Kong]

Would this happen again on submarines?. it is a sad tragedy and should not have happened.
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Daily Mail on line, Wednesday, Dec 14 2011 9AM 5°C 12PM 7°C 5-Day Forecast

Navy lieutenant killed herself aboard warship after senior officer called her 'sweetheart'Inquest heard 'feisty' Sara had argued with male boss who accidently offended her by calling her 'sweetheart'
Boss said he meant the comment as a term of 'endearment'
By Ian Drury

Last updated at 2:05 AM on 14th December 2011

Feisty: Sara Elizabeth Hellawell was said to have been offended by the senior officer's comment
A female Royal Navy Royal Navy officer killed herself after her boss called her ‘sweetheart’, an inquest heard yesterday.Lieutenant Sara Hellawell, 26, took an overdose in her locked cabin on board HMS Edinburgh.
The ‘feisty’ marine engineer had become upset with line manager Lieutenant Commander Philip Boakes when they had a cigarette together on the deck of the Type 42 destroyer.
In a statement, Lt Cdr Boakes said: ‘We had a discussion about how some people had not showed themselves in the best light on a sun downs (a break on land) and maybe they should be cancelled.
‘Later Sara appeared to be distressed. I asked her what was the matter and she said it was her mum. I said if she wanted to go home it could be arranged, but she said “No”.
‘I said “Listen, sweetheart” which I meant to be a term of endearment, but she said it was condescending.’
Lt Hellawell stormed off the deck and was found dead at 8am on June 16 after crewmate Helen Wright forced open her locked cabin door.
A post-mortem examination revealed Lt Hellawell, who grew up Ampthill, Bedfordshire, died from drug toxicity caused by amitriptyline, an anti-depressant used to treat irritable bowel syndrome, and codeine, a painkiller.

Lt Hellawell had been given a six-month supply of medication before HMS Edinburgh set sail on a seven-month deployment from Portsmouth on May 25.
The vessel was taking part in an anti-piracy operation off the coast of Angola before travelling on to the Falkland Islands.
Dunstable Coroner’s Court heard there was nothing in Lt Hellawell’s medical history to suggest she was suffering from depression.


Read more: Navy Lieutenant Sara Elizabeth Hellawell, 26 killed herself after senior officer called her 'sweetheart' | Mail Online

[Glan Phillips]

Certainly a sad tragedy,what I find troubling is that she was given a six month supply of medication prior to HMS Edinburgh setting sail. During my 12 years List1 & List 3 RNR service, medications prescribed for crew members was securely kept by the ship's medical officer and issued as prescibed. Being called 'sweetheart' I would not call offensive. Now if someone called me 'sweetheart' I may well be offended !!!

[Jacyn Wade]

Very sad indeed. Interesting point there, Glan. Six months of drugs would be a lot, and I would think a concern for someone serving on a submarine.

This being offended by being called 'sweetheart' is certainly a new generational issue, unfortunately. She clearly must have had other problems though as I cannot imagine committing suicide over something so trivial as being called 'sweetheart', no matter how it was used.

When I was a legal assistant, I once had an elderly lawyer very quietly and cautiously compliment me on my 'lovely ankles.' He was very sweet but concerned about making such a comment, which is telling of our times. Of course, I accepted the compliment graciously and in the spirit in which it was meant. It's too bad the younger generation can't accept some of what were once life's little niceties.

So, the moral, I suppose, is if these women are going to put themselves in a man's world, they'd better open their minds and prepare themselves for what comes. If they can't do that, they don't belong there.

[Keith at Tregenna]

RE: So, the moral, I suppose, is if these women are going to put themselves in a man's world, they'd better open their minds and prepare themselves for what comes. If they can't do that, they don't belong there.

Hard to decide on a like or thanks button, appreciate where your coming from etc.

2011 and ladies in the RN are still known as lumpy Jumpers, terms used such as travelling with excess baggage are age old, most hopefully is meant in humour, but not to die for.

K.