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Thread: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

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    Default Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    I've just been sent a copy of a 'C R 10 Identity Certificate 114300' -- with attached photo -- that I'm almost certain is that of my maternal grandfather. Date of birth (17.1.1886) and place (Morelia, Mexico) match.

    Is there any way I can find out where and when that certificate was issued? From the photo I'd guess 1920ish .. but he looks quite well which (given he was torpedoed three times in the war and was apparently badly injured the third time) was a bit of a surprise.

    Many thanks!

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    Keith at Tregenna's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    Ernesto Gil
    United Kingdom, Merchant Navy Seamen Records, 1835-1941

    Ernesto Gil
    Event Type:
    Military Service
    Event Year Range:
    1918-1921
    Event Place:
    United Kingdom
    Birthplace:
    Mexico
    Birth Year:
    1886

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    C R 10 Identity Certificate 114300'

    In actual fact that CR10 is not an Identity Cert, if you do have the actual CR10 it should show all the details of his Service as far as I am aware??
    The place of issue should be there as well.
    Cheers

    This may assist ??

    http://rmhh.co.uk/files/Merchant_Sea...l_Research.pdf


    2.2 Aug 1918- Dec 1921. BT350. CR10 card index (The Special Register)
    In the spring and summer of 1918 the British Government faced a manpower crisis on the Western Front. The British army had suffered 300,000 casualties, including 40,000 dead, in the German attacks of March and April.1 Conscription age limits were extended and those who were exempt from conscription like the 270,000 multinational workforce in the British Merchant Marine were subjected to closer scrutiny. This so-called special register was designed to allow the Government to check that the merchant seaman’s exemption from conscription ‘ is not abused by men taking an unduly long period ashore between voyages.’2
    The CR10 cards were introduced in August 1918 together, with a new identity and service certificate (RS2 book) to be carried by the seaman. The introduction of the seaman’s passport style photograph is an important feature. It also appears that seamen who were engaged solely in home trade, and who did, therefore, not need a discharge book, were brought into the central index system for the first time. The CR1 card was phased out, but the CR2 card continued in use referenced to the new identity number (RS2 no).
    CR10 cards are arranged alphabetically and provide personal, photo, and voyage details with the new id no as numerical identifier. This number is often referred to as the RS2 no. The personal details can be more detailed than found on a CR1 card as they include date of birth rather than just the year, and also next of kin details for perhaps one in eight seamen. The Discharge A number may also be noted.
    If the seaman already possessed a discharge book then the Board of Trade asked that the id no (RS2 no) should be marked at the top of page 1.3
    For numbering purposes seamen were placed in one of five groups
    Group a ; 5001 to 100,000. Masters and navigating officers.
    Group b: 100,001 to 200,000. Engineer Officers, refrigeration engineers and electricians.
    Group c; 200,001 to 300,000. Surgeons, pursers, apprentices, and wireless operators.
    Group d; 300,001 to 800,000. Sailors, firemen and other men and boys of the deck and engine room.
    Group e; 800,001 to 999,999. Stewards, cooks and other members of the catering staff.
    Last edited by Doc Vernon; 18th September 2019 at 08:48 PM.
    Senior Site Moderator-Member and Friend of this Website

    R697530

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    Keith at Tregenna's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    Possibly ?

    Name: Ernesto Gil
    Event Type: Marriage
    Event Place: Cardiff, Glamorganshire, Wales
    Registration District: Cardiff
    County: Glamorganshire
    Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
    Registration Year: 1914
    Volume: 11A
    Page: 578
    Affiliate Line Number: 72
    Spouse Name (available after 1911): Thomas

    Possible Spouse: Mary J M Thomas

    K.

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Vernon View Post
    [LEFT][COLOR=#333333][FONT=Verdana]C R 10 Identity Certificate 114300'

    In actual fact that CR10 is not an Identity Cert, if you do have the actual CR10 it should show all the details of his Service as far as I am aware??
    The place of issue should be there as well.
    Cheers
    I have a photo of it; some of that information is not there (or the photo may not show the whole card?). Here is what I have:

    Ernesto-Gil-ID-certificate.jpg

    Ideas welcome!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yes, that's him. The latest 'sighting' I have is that he disembarked in New York in 1927, and his wife and daughter (my mother) sailed on the Mauretania to visit him in August 1930. Also I cannot find any information of his WWI activities.

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    That is only part of the entire CR10 Documentation I think there should be other info such as his Ships etc,but am not positive. Will look into it I think Billy if he reads this will tell us !
    Cheers
    Senior Site Moderator-Member and Friend of this Website

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    Ernesto Gil
    New York Passenger Arrival Lists (Ellis Island), 1892-1924
    Tools
    Name:
    Ernesto Gil
    Event Type:
    Immigration
    Event Date:
    26 May 1924
    Event Place:
    Ellis Island, New York City, New York, United States
    Residence Place:
    Port Talbot, Wales
    Gender:
    Male
    Age:
    38
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Nationality:
    Mexico, Mexican
    Birth Year:
    1886
    Departure Port:
    Liverpool
    Ship Name:
    Celtic

    Name:
    Ernesto Gil
    Event Type:
    Immigration
    Event Date:
    26 May 1924
    Event Place:
    Ellis Island, New York City, New York, United States
    Residence Place:
    Port Talbot, Wales
    Gender:
    Male
    Age:
    38
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Nationality:
    Mexico, Mexican
    Birth Year:
    1886
    Departure Port:
    Liverpool
    Ship Name:
    Celtic


    ?

    K.

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    Yes; I also found a later one of those (1927).

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    What you have is part of BT372 and do not hold full service details. The CR10 cards are arranged alphabetically and provide personal, photo, and voyage details with the new id no as numerical identifier. This number is often referred to as the RS2 no. The personal details can be more detailed than found on a CR1 card as they include date of birth rather than just the year, and also next of kin details for perhaps one in eight seamen. The Discharge A number may also be noted. A lot of these files in BT372 are hit and miss and sometimes hold little or no info of worth.

    CRS-10 files are different to CR10. CRS-10 files hold the individuals service record, but there are no surviving records from WWI as they were all destroyed. You would be able to find his service after 1918 in the Fourth or Fifth Register, depending on when he left the MN. The Fourth Register runs until 1940 and then records were moved into the Fifth Register from 1941 onwards.
    "Across the seas where the great waves grow, there are no fields for the poppies to grow, but its a place where Seamen sleep, died for their country, for you and for peace" (Billy McGee 2011)

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    Default Re: Looking for information on Ernesto Gil ... CR 10 ID 114300

    OK, thanks. Are these available online? The image I posted was sent to me by a third party, and I don't know where it came from.

    [PS .. I am travelling for the next 10 days; will check this thread when I get back!]

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