P&O Ferries

[j.sabourn]

#30 Never heard of it being a closed shop .It was an association . And called a union only in title when re-named Union as in Numast.It had no teeth and was more of a friendly society and. There for advice and discussion I found. It later became more closer to a job advertiser. In as was there purely for coverage for loss of certification and insurance and legal representation. Originally they cost 5 pounds a year for this, which was well worth it. When they went into individual wage consultation with ships personel doing the individual wage discussions they lost all Their baby teeth as any reference to a union they may have had. During the Enquiry on the PA as have previously said ,I was disgusted with some of the media’s statements and as I was one of the last called to the stand months after the event, insisted that they give me a solicitor to accompany me, Numast tried to tell me I did not need one , but I had been watching how statements given to the press were taken out of context and nothing said ,so I insisted and got. It was my intention to take the media to task and sue them if necessary. This must have been noted by same and the board of enquiry and was only on the stand for minutes as against hours for some. They still got their little bit of disinformation however but it was so juvenile in its application I thought it childish and anyone of intelligence would laugh at. So let it go. Numast was worth being a member , but not for the reasons of facing up to employers they didn’t have the grunt of what I saw. Cheers JS
PS the MNAOA for anyone who doesn’t know stands for merchant navy & airline officers association. JS .....
Julian according to your CV you are surprisingly young to remember the MNAOA , can you remember when their title was changed ? Know it was the Numast in 1975 and well before that. NUMAST again for those who don’t know stands for National Union Marine of Sea and Air Transport . Cheers JS

[Des Taff Jenkins]

Here in Oz back in the 60's about 95% of the workforce was in a union, now less than 11% are.
The NUS had to amalgamate with the CFMEU to survive a couple of years ago.

That is a union that did the most damage to the image of unions by it's actions on building sites and the like.
A number of builders went bust here in Victoria due to their actions and no work for those who lost their job.

Not all unions are bad but the CFMEU and at one time the Electrical one certainly did nothing to enhance their reputation with the average person.

Now with most big companies going to enterprize bargaining for wages and conditions there is little use for unions now.

Wrong John.
That is why wages have not moved in over ten years, despite the massive rise in the cost of living of 7%
Des

[Graham Shaw]

As long as seafarers from impoverished countries can pay the recruiting agencies quite often substantial backhanders to secure a berth on a ship they will sign on for years at £3.00 per hour .After all,£3.00 per hour in such countries is a comparative fortune back home. And aboard ship,it's not so much about the wage as about what dealings you can do on the side,ashore or afloat. There will always be a plentiful supply of those unfortunates to do the job. Nice of P &O to exploit the situation....

[John Arton]

In another thread the nationality of the staff on board and their work/leave ratio was given. I wonder where those staff go when on leave, doubt P&O are paying air fares for them to go to their home countries so I guess hostels, b&b's etc must be making a good profit from P&O staff on leave.
Rgds
J.A.

[Jim R Christie]

#30 Never heard of it being a closed shop .It was an association . And called a union only in title when re-named Union as in Numast.NUMAST again for those who don’t know stands for National Union Marine of Sea and Air Transport . Cheers JS

John,
The MNAOA became NUMAST back in 1985 when it merged with the Radio and Electronic Officers Union (Sparkies and Leckies).

[happy daze john in oz]

Des, not so sure about that mate.
Have a couple of very good friends who work for Woolworths supermarkets.
They tell me they get an increase in wages every year though they did not say how much.
But they do say it is a good figure.

Bunnings I know pay penalty rates for public holidays but on normal days if you have to do overtime you get time off in lieu.

Yet for all of that with unemployment at a 30 year low the shortage of staff in many industries is alarming.

But no matter who is in gov I do not see much change to the current wage structure.

[Des Taff Jenkins]

John.
How can unemployment be at a 30 year low, but Companies can't get staff? they shouldn't need workers as; according to Hoil their are no unemployed!!in my eyes it means that the unemployed are working on cash in hand, or have left the workforce, if I go up the local RSL for dinner it is full of younger people who seem to have cash, maybe the drug scene is bigger than I thought. Maybe this is the problem, my grand daughter works in a Super Market, they have staff but very few do a full weeks work, they just ring up sick, they have enough to pay for their mobile phones, Mum provides the food, can't get staff, but no unemployment.
Des

[happy daze john in oz]

Des, I know in hospitality there is a big shortage of workers, but is it a shortage or just that some do not want to work?

It is too easy I think to get the dole or to be kept by the bank of mum and dad.
Not just the young but some of the middle aged do not appear to be too keen on work if they can survive on some other means.

A shortage of overseas students is part of the shortage in some areas such as fruit picking and hospitality, but they are on the way back we are told, that may ease the situation.

[cappy]

Too many benefits ....and i hate the word benefits .....plus a bit of a cash job .....3 or 4 hours no tax.....better than full time to many ......to my thoughts benefits should be food chitties and help with the rent ...only after truly cannot find work....its gone beyond the pale in the uk now ....and appears the same in oz......as for heating go and get sea coal like we did ....or chop a bloody tree down........I constantly see woman on tele who say they cant work they have 4 or five kids .....no man about.....but all with moby phones .....a 6 foot tele .....and the obligitary ....staffie or similar ....and often a car outside the door .....to go to the food banks in ....one even stated she parks it round the corner .....as she doesnt like the food bank purveyors to see it ...jeez valhalla or not....... the food banks are a new scenario ......the money banks are already here ...they are just called ......benefits......cappy

[Louis the fly]

I don't know the work rotas or leave systems which applied on P&O Dover ferries or those in the Irish Sea and Liverpool.
On the Hull ferries it was 14 days on 14 days off on full pay. The working day was 12 hours seven days a week with a consolidated pay structure to allow for the overtime. Many years ago the ferries flagged out to the Bahamas to avoid paying out national insurance on their crews. A large section of the British catering department were replaced with Portuguese crew, they were on six months contract without leave pay.
AB's had to be fully qualified with course's in fire fighting, sea survival and certificate of proficiency in survival craft.
I read this morning some of the replacement crews are being paid as little as £3.40 an hour and are expected to be on board for 11 months.
This couldn't happen on Dutch or French ferries because they have employment laws to prevent it. Over the years British workers have lost all the working rights they once had. For all of you who complain about unions this is the outcome when workers are open to exploitation, a race to the bottom.