who is to blame the white man for buying or the black man for selling slaves to the white man????????jp
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who is to blame the white man for buying or the black man for selling slaves to the white man????????jp
We the British have nothing to apologise for, no country did more for abolishment of Slavery and stood to loose more from its abolishment.
Recently I visited a Savery Exhibition at the Albert Dock and there was no mention of William Wilberforce! just a very small painting of him with no explanation. Clearly the exhibition was a triumph to the Liverpool Bread Kniters.
The Royal Navy dedicated a small fleet of wooden Gun Boats for over 60 years to inforce to ban and have a proud history to their name.
Regards
Steve
R770014
John I agree with you exept perhaps for a couple of things. The anglo saxons were great slave traders their slaves were the indigenous celts and they established the Port of London as their slave base, this trade was " Government " sponsored as they had "apartite" type laws to enable it .Blair rightly or wrongly made the apology on behalf of the British people not only the English . If an apology was needed it would have been better if it had been made by the Head of State and not the prime minister, and would have had more impact and credibility.
Everything has to be put in its correct time frame or historical period , Of course the British Empire was a dreadfull, inhuman institution, but so were many other Colonial powers of that time ( some a great deal worse) all now confined to history. Britain has moved on to its credit, and in a very short time frame when you consider that most of us in this forum were born subjects of an emperor not citizens of a nation. True there is some way to go yet before the bye products of slavery such as racism are finally dead but Britain can rightly be proud that it's actions now speak louder than any apology
John I agree with you exept perhaps for a couple of things. The anglo saxons were great slave traders their slaves were the indigenous celts and they established the Port of London as their slave base, this trade was " Government " sponsored as they had "apartite" type laws to enable it
Eifion.
..
In the days of the Anglo Saxon there was no British or English Government to sponsor a slave trade.. Britain was a collection of Kingdoms all independent of each other and in a lot of cases were always at war with each other..
I dont mind being born the subject of an Emperor, got to be much better than a Citizen of a Political President like el presidente Bliar.
No appology is needed. and I dont believe the British Empire was a dreadfull, inhuman institution, I think it did a lot of good to a lot of countries and people across the world. I saw a lot of countries in the old Empire and I have seen those countries since Independence, The people were a hell of a lot better off under British Rule than they are now.
They have Presidents like Idi Amin, Mugabe, Nkruma, and many many other despots starving them and killing them and all oposition. They went back to their tribal ways , one tribe killing other tribes, it is what they do best.
So we were not all bad. I was in Nigeria after the Biafra war, several people there wanted to know when the British were coming back, they were happier then.
Every African Colony fell in a heap and millions of people died, all ruled by ruthless Dictators. No one can name one good African President of an ex Colony.
I think if anyone does not like our system then they should emigrate to one of these countries and see the difference.
When President Monroe of the USA bought the land which is now Liberia, [Freedom ] and Monrovia was named after him, for all the slaves in the Americas, very few ever wanted to go back to Africa.
Africa is still a warmongers paradise.
Cheers
Brian.
[QUOTE=stevesherratt;100100]We the British have nothing to apologise for, no country did more for abolishment of Slavery and stood to loose more from its abolishment.QUOTE]
STEVEN without besmirching our own royal navy didn't we used to press ordinary folk by force to man the ships of our navy is that not a form of slavery? we sent kids to Canada Australia knowing they would be just work horses{slaves } to farmers we are not without blame or shame when it comes to slavery people in this country had iron collars on from youth to death we did have a very bad history when it comes to the lower classes of that period of history? didn't president Lincoln have slaves!!!! that says it all. just a thought. jp
Saying sorry must have been a Labour trend acouple of years back. Our Labor gov here has appologised for just about all of the crimes ever commited by humanity. They said sorry to the Aboriginals, sorry to the school children brought out here during and just after the war, sorry for taking babies from their mothers in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's sorry fpr the kids abused by priests. But what are they appolgising for, the acts or their negligence at the time thta allowed such things to take place/ You cannot appologise for the sins of your predesessors. As to the kids brought out here, it was the British gov who agreed with the Oz gov at the time to do so. Many of them had been evacuated to the North then told their families had all been killed in the blitz and sent to Oz Canada and South Africa. It was only in recent years that the truth came out, their families were never killed.
Hi shipmates, I asked my wife to say she sorry about the deeds back by the British government and the crown her great great great grand father committed on the drugs/sliver/ slaves voyage and to return the money and property and slave /drugs trade medal , cant print what she said , but see the Tory partys reply to give back the donations from the polly peck crook, with swear words added on may give you a clue.
If I was a ratepayer in Liverpool I would want an apology from both blair and the local council for slandering the good people of the city and wasting ratepayers money on such an excercise that only appeals to a bigoted few
john sutton
Good One John.
.
No Slaves ever came to Liverpool, The Government didnt do slaves. It was oportunist Ship owners making a fast buck.
Here is the scenario....
. The sailing ships had to follow the trade winds, which in the Atlantic blow clockwise. So the sailing ship sails down to West Africa, The Master buys the slaves from the coastal Tribes , who get their "goods" from the Inland tribes, who they have always been at war with, So they realised that instead of killing the Inland Tribes they could make a living by selling them. [I do not hear any appologies from the West Coast of Africa,]Now that part of the coast is the Bight of Benin, Hence the old Seamen`s saying........
"Beware the Bight of Benin,
Many Sailors go, Very few come out."
That is why the west Coast was known as The White Mans Grave.
On Ascension Island is a cemetery full of British Sailors from Royal Navy ships that patrolled the West African coast to prevent Slave Trading, they all died of the diseases. WHERE ARE THE APPOLOGIES FOR THOSE YOUNG MEN????. The death toll of Sailors was higher than the Slaves. due to diseases, Yellow Fever, Blackwater Fever, Cholera, Malaria,
Typhoid and so on. [ How many Liverpool Councillors have complained and demanded an appologie from the Liverpool Shipowners.] NONE
.
The ship would then follow the Trade Winds to the Indies and Southern States of Good Old USA.
The cargo of Slaves was a valuable commodity, ........
A slave in poor condition, starved, weak, covered in scabs was worthless , But a big buck, strong and healthy would command a good price from the Plantation owners at the Auctions.
So it was in the Shippers interests to keep them well nourished often at the Seaman`s expense to make the most profit.
After the slaves were sold at Auction then a cargo would be loaded, Tobacco, Cotton and so on.
The ship would then follow the Trade Winds back to Liverpool.
AND SO LIVERPOOL NEVER HAD ANY SLAVES, WHAT IS IT ALL ABOUT? ALL THIS SELF FLAGELATION AND HAND WRINGING AND APPOLOGIES?????????????
As John says, if I lived in Liverpool I would want an appologie from all those hand wringers and Liverpool Council for wasting my Tax Payers Money.
GET WISE , DO- GOODERS. .
. Brian.
The Sack of Baltimore took place on June 20, 1631, when the village of Baltimore, West Cork, Ireland, was attacked by North African pirates from the North African Barbary Coast. The attack was the biggest single attack by the Barbary pirates on Ireland or Britain. The attack was led by a Dutch captain turned pirate, Jan Janszoon van Haarlem, also known as Murad Reis the Younger. Murad's force was led to the village by a man called Hackett, the captain of a fishing boat he had captured earlier, in exchange for his freedom. Hackett was subsequently hanged from the clifftop outside the village for his conspiracy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Brady
Murad's crew, made up of Dutchmen, Algerians and Ottoman Turks, launched their covert attack on the remote village on June 20th 1631. They captured 108 English settlers, who worked a pilchard industry in the village, and some local Irish people. The attack was focused on the area of the village known to this day as the Cove. The villagers were put in irons and taken to a life of slavery in North Africa. Some prisoners were destined to live out their days as galley slaves, while others would spend long years in the seclusion of the Sultan's harem or within the walls of the Sultan's palace as laborers. At most three of them ever saw Ireland again.
Conspiracy theories abound relating to the raid. It has been suggested Sir Walter Coppinger orchestrated the raid to gain control of the village from the local Gaelic chieftain, Fineen O'Driscoll. It was O'Driscoll who had licenced the lucrative pilchard industry in Baltimore to the English settlers. In the aftermath of the raid, the remaining settlers moved to Skibereen.
The incident inspired Thomas Osborne Davis to write his famous poem, The Sack of Baltimore. A detailed account of the sack of Baltimore can be found in the book The Stolen Village: Baltimore and the Barbary Pirates by Des Ekin.
In 1999, the raid on Baltimore was portrayed in a screenplay titled "Roaring Water, The Sack of Baltimore", by Irish screenwriter Sean Boyle.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
LINK: Sack of Baltimore - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I bought a copy of The Stolen Village a few years ago in Kinsale, an interesting. thought provoking read:
K.