Mercantile Marine Shipping Offices / British Shipping Federation

[j.sabourn]

Ref. The first MMO. Do these still exist today? I know there is a certain amount of paperwork and records etc. etc. to keep and follow up on, but due to the lack of shipping as such nowadays cant see the object of. In the old days of a ship paying off there were always a large contingent down to vessel to see the ship being paid off, as to the work involved it was either the Master or whoever he delegated to do all the sums, usually the 2nd. mate. Why they got the title Shipping Master beats me, as the ones I saw didnt particularly look like ex seafarers.
As regards the British Shipping Federation, I know these dont exist anymore, unless they have made a comeback unknown to me. As the recent discussion on Unions, I would class these as the Owners Union. I remember coming back into British ships after being away for a few years, having found my own job I had to go and get cleared by the BSF in Newcastle. For those sailing out of the Tyne they can probably remember Sandy a little Hitler. There was an engineer in front of me getting a hard time from him. On my turn he demanded to see my Dis. Book as at that time if you were away on foreign flag all hell used to be let loose. I told him to mind his own business and just sign the paper that had to be signed. Which he did. I sometimes wonder what all these people who lived off the back of seafarers received in the way of redundancy payments. I wouldnt mind betting it was well in excess of what I finally got, which have stated in a previous post. When you think back on all those who relied on shipping, Customs, Ship Chandlers, Agents, etc. and the poorest paid of the lot were the seamen. Everyone looked down their nose at but he was the mainstay of their life style. Cheers John Sabourn P.S. Could state other occupations but had better not.

[DeepSea]

I can't remember exactly when all the Pools closed, but I think it was the back end of the 1980's. I was a Pool man on the new Middlesbrough Pool at Dundas Arcade from 1980 and this closed down mid 80's and I was transferred to South Shields. I got a weeks relief from them to join the Elk on the Tees, but ended up staying with P&O on four of their ships for five years even though I was still registered on the Pool. We received notification that all the pools were being shut down and a central agency was being opened, I think in Birmingham, but don't quote me on that. All Seamen then became available from one agency, which I believe you paid a percentage too when a ship came up, unlike when the companies were responsible for paying to get men off the Pool. We were informed by the Union that some money had been put aside from all the Pools for any men who left the sea, and would receive some sort of severance based on their sea time. Unfortunately when I left the sea in 1992 on medical grounds and applied for my Pool severance from the Union, I was informed I was not entitled to it due to the circumstances of my leaving the sea and the Union pocketed about £1500 of my severance. I wish I had been more knowledgeable in those days, as I would have fought the b*****d's all the way to get it.

[Captain Kong]

What ever happened to all the assets, Property, Money, etc .etc. in UK and overseas, Houses and offices world wide, of the National Seamens Union.
Must have been £millions, I remember Tom Yates, Union boss in 40s and 50s , He made his ,never been to sea, Son, the Sydney,Union Delegate there, he lived in a big house in Vaucluse, [milionaires patch] overlooking Sydney Harbour, and a Union Office there. What happened to all our money???
Brian.

[John Arton]

My mate when I was doing 2nd Mates in 71 came from North Shields (his dad a big fish merchants business on the quayside). He served his time in Joe Shell and his indentures finished in the August. He took his 2nd mates in july and got a referrel in one paper so was looking to take a resit at the end of Sept.
As he was getting no dosh he signed on the dole and got a few weeks money before an officious bertard from the dole knocked on his parents door and said unless my mate got himself down the pool in North Shields tout sweet he would be arrested. I was visiting at the time so the pair of us made our way down to the pool where some little officious bertard procedeed to tear a strip of my mate, telling him as a seafarer he was not entitled to dole money and should have come to the pool. My mate asked him if the pool would give him dosh to live on to which he was told no, but they had a ship for him so he could earn some dosh. My mate explained his situation regarding his resit and if he missed the Sept. exam he would lose the referral and have to take the whole set of papers again. The twerp behind the desk was having non of it and proceeded to give my mate jobs on ships that entailed at least a 4 month trip, so taking any of them would have meant losing his passed papers. The third and last ship he was offerred was with an outfit that did min. 6 months trips so again my mate refused it. The official then became angry telling my mate that that was it, no work again ever on U.K. ships. My mate ( a bit of a hot head) was nearly across the desk at the twerp and a right fracas occurred. We both eventually marched out swearing we wanted nothing to with the bertards in the pool. My mate got a job washing up in a Whitley Bay hotel until he sat his resit and passed. Then right away got a job with Bank Line, spent a number of years with them, met a Aussie lass and eventually around 1978 emigrated to Aus., I believe he ended up in Tasmania but I lost touch with him once he emigrated, would'nt mind getting back in touch with him.
We had some great nights out together including one infamous night doing the rounds of all the South and North shields dives with a cadet from the East End of London.
rgds
Capt. John Arton (ret'd)

[Captain Kong]

That is a wild place at night doing the rounds of Shields and Whitley Bay, especially the Rex Hotel. Nearly died there after one month staying there during a dry dock in Walsend.
Thanks for the memory John.
Brian

[j.sabourn]

Know what you mean John, there are some twits everywhere you go. Years ago (1968) I was Ch.Off. on a cargo passenger vessel under the Liberian Flag, vessel owned by Alcoa. I flew out on seamans papers to Canada to join. However as the run down to the West Indies every 6 weeks or so involved calling in at Puerto Rico, got rather complicated with the Immigration Authoritys. Myself and 2nd. Eng. both from same part of the world and with same problem re. passports decided to get passports in Trinidad. All relevant papers were left in Port of Spain at the High Commissioners and were told could pick up in 6 weeks when next there. On return and going up to the High Commissioners was interviewed individually me first by this little upstart, an Englishman, looking down his nose at me he wanted to know why the ship I was on was not in my Discharge Book. I told him it was a British Discharge book and I was on a Foreign vessel it was not necessary. ( already discussed the problems going foreign flag in those days) He then said I want to see that ship stamped in your book, I said it is not going in the book, he said I am not giving you a passport. The screams must have been heard outside as both the engineer and myself were thrown out by the security, a difficult job for them as the engineer was 6 ft 4 ins tall. I immediately wrote to Dame Irene Ward MP for Tynemouth. Later I received an apology from I think 12 Downing street? ( foreign affairs) saying as an excuse that the person who I had my altercation with thought I may have been one of the Great Train Robbers. However as an after to this saga, the English populance at that time was very secular and I was told in a roundabout way that my presence was not required at any does that they frequented. This also had a backlash with my employers. You cant beat the pricks. Regards John Sabourn.

[j.sabourn]

Spent it on the Pokies Brian. John Sabourn

[Des Taff Jenkins]

Hi Brian.
Sir Tom Yates if you please, knighted for disservises to Merchant Seamen. Story went he bought his daughter a Rolls Royce on her wedding day from union funds as a present from British seamen.
John .
It often puzzled me about the people in the pool office in Swansea; in what thier uniform represented, There was one bloke in there who must have been all of sixteen who had stripes on his sleeve, and a right prat.
Cheers Desredc.gif

[happy daze john in oz]

What ever happened to all the assets, Property, Money, etc .etc. in UK and overseas, Houses and offices world wide, of the National Seamens Union.
Must have been £millions, I remember Tom Yates, Union boss in 40s and 50s , He made his ,never been to sea, Son, the Sydney,Union Delegate there, he lived in a big house in Vaucluse, [milionaires patch] overlooking Sydney Harbour, and a Union Office there. What happened to all our money???
Brian.

Quite easy to understand Brian, many of those offcicials became politicians and we know how they can make money disapear. Think most of them must come from the families of magicians.

[Captain Kong]

I think maybe our `Lord` John Prescott may have a few answers to the question.
Cheers
Brian.