Bye.bye, Red Ensign on the Queens.

[Jacyn Wade]

I may have grown up in Canada, but I'm English born and always supportive of the homeland!

[Capt Bill Davies]

At very least if Cunardto

Tony,
There is a name for what you are suggesting. Let's not demean any further what is/has happened to the Red Ensign.

Brgds

Bill

[Tony Morcom]

Tony,
There is a name for what you are suggesting. Let's not demean any further what is/has happened to the Red Ensign.

Brgds

Bill

Sorry Bill, not sure I understand what you are getting at. Are you saying that the Government shouldn't be entitled to any tax payments Forgive me for being a bit thick at this time of night. Maybe I am missing something here.

Regards

[Capt Bill Davies]

Sorry Bill, Regards

Tony,

I am merely saying that I think we are all in danger of being a little too patriotic to a flag which in itself has morphed into something you, me and many others our our generation would not recognize. The government, MCA et al, sold out years ago making it clear 'anything' was for sale. Look at the MCA website. Most distasteful.

Brgds

Bill

[Ivan Cloherty]

Tony,


Brgds

Bill

But surely Bill with all due respect it is up to us, and others who feel the same, to bring back the proudness we felt serving under the Red Duster, no matter what it has morphed into. I for one am not ashamed to be too patriotic to a country in which I was born, served, and gave me a living despite all its current failings. It is up to us to see that the respect due for our flags does not fall into further decline. On this matter we should all be singing from the same hymn sheet, after all this is a "Merchant Navy" site and therefore surely we should respect the flag we sailed under and engender others to do the same.

For me it will always have a place in my heart.

[Capt Bill Davies]

Ivan/Tony,

Just a note to clarify my previous posts should they appear obtuse. I have the greatest respects and admiration for what you believe unfortunately the people running the country do not and that is what I find difficult. My last trip on a British Flag vessel was as Chief Officer in 1967 and I have fond memories of the many tramps I sailed in following my departure from the the China boats in early 61. I sensed then that things were changing and not for the better.

What has happened is nothing short of disgraceful and is the result of a long term plan by the government to divest itself of a fleet that was once the envy of the world.
In the 60s the British Master Mariners Certificate was recognized as be second to none, it was acknowledged as being the best and my Liberian Master Mariners certificate issued in 69 was issued on the British Masters Mariners (FG) I passed in 1967.

Many of us have great memories of the Red Ensign when it signified a British ship with British personnel on board.
What you have now is Chinese Container Shipowners with full Chinese crew on board with a 'token' British cadet' onboard to justify the 'tonnage tax'. What type of training is he going to get?

Was it not a former CEO of the MCA who was the main driver in 'flagging out' the Red Ensign and then took up a position on the board of that company when retired from the MCA. There is a story their somewhere.

The Red Ensign as a national flag on a national carrier is one thing. The Red Ensign as a Flag of Convenience (which is what it has been reduced to) is another.

Brgds


Bill

[Ivan Cloherty]

Ivan/Tony,


The Red Ensign as a national flag on a national carrier is one thing.
Brgds
Bill

Thank you Bill for clarify your posts, whilst we all sympathise with them, it is up to us to try and let the powers that be know, that we are not satisfied with the situation. We may be pizzing against the wind, but from little acorns mighty oaks grow.

No the z replaces the s because of rules and I have not gone all yankee

[George]

Hi All, It has been suggested that Cunard shouldn't be allowed to use names of British Monarchs for there Ships. Sadly when the preseant Queens where Named here in Southampton, Cunard was already an American Company, and our once Proud Ensgn a FLAG of Conviniance, just as the Monrovian flag was an probably still is. Says a lot for our Politicians, over the last 63 years.
George in Southampton

[Captain Kong]

The other day I wrote to Mr Flounders of Cunard, in Southampton to have a confirmation and the reason why Cunard are placing their ships under the Bermuda Flag.
Here is his answer and should clarify the position............
.
.
Dear Captain Aspinall

Thank you for your email about Cunard vessel registry. I am sorry for my delay in replying but I have been away on holiday and only returned to the office this morning.

Yes, you are correct that the registry is to be changed from the UK to Bermuda. However, since Bermuda is a UK overseas territory with The Queen as Head of State, the ships will continue to fly the Red Ensign.

Before I go into the reasons for the change I do think it needs to be put into some sort of context. Cunard has owned over 200 ships, and of those only 9 were ever registered in Southampton (including the current 3). Our ffirst Southampton registry was in 1969, some 130 years after the company was founded. On the wider point of UK registry generally, Cunard has actually registered ships overseas for many years. When I joined the company we had a fleet of nine vessels - eight of which were registered in either Norway or The Bahamas.

The reason for the change is that the company wishes to conduct weddings on board in response to a consistent demand. This is a growing and lucrative business which at present is denied to Cunard as the law of England and Wales, to which we are currently subject, requires in the Marriages Act that approved places for marriages must be publicly accessible. Clearly a ship at sea is not.

We are changing registry reluctantly, but in these difficult economic times it would not be sensible for Cunard to miss out on a lucrative area of business - or at least, not if we want Cunard to prosper.

I hope this goes some way to explaining our posiition

Yours sincerely

Eric Flounders


Flagging out of the Queens.

brian aspinall to: eric.flounders 29/10/2011 11:13

[Ivan Cloherty]

The other day I wrote to Mr Flounders
brian aspinall to: eric.flounders 29/10/2011 11:13

Thanks for that Brian, tried to use the "Thank you" button, but it will not let me.