Frexit

No matter who gave money, who did what it matters not, the outcome of the referendum is all that democracy is about. I cannot for the life of me understand why there are so many undemocratic people in UK.

As to Russia, they are no bigger threat to the west than any other nation who wants to attempt to take over. Russia has so much natural resources, oil, gas the west needs them. But the people, not just the present day leader are of far greater importance, they are, as is the case in all, the country.


Democratic or not any leader who outs the country first will always get my vote.

Lewis, an EU army lead by some EU person who decides he wants to go to war for some reason just he thinks is good, not for me or any sensible person.

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Originally Posted by Lewis McColl

What is the objection to a European army???

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Why do we need one ? , another cost that is not needed or wanted , I voted to join on the EEC , not the EU , I neither want or agree with federalisation from the 27 there are an awful lot of corrupt politicians , especially in southern Europe , we have our own , with no need for more , but a European army NO THANKS

So Rob should we pull out of NATO then? as you say we have our own armed forces, but if the politicians keep cutting back, while at the same time sending young men & women to wars that have bugger all to do with the UK ??

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Originally Posted by happy daze john in oz

No matter who gave money, who did what it matters not, the outcome of the referendum is all that democracy is about. I cannot for the life of me understand why there are so many undemocratic people in UK.

As to Russia, they are no bigger threat to the west than any other nation who wants to attempt to take over. Russia has so much natural resources, oil, gas the west needs them. But the people, not just the present day leader are of far greater importance, they are, as is the case in all, the country.


Democratic or not any leader who outs the country first will always get my vote.

Lewis, an EU army lead by some EU person who decides he wants to go to war for some reason just he thinks is good, not for me or any sensible person.

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John sorry but that is a weak argument , check history when was the last time you can remember that the UK was not involved in some war somewhere. Perhaps if the UK were in a European Army we may not be so trigger happy. Look at the mess intervention in Lybia .

that is precisely my point Lewis we are in NATO and The UN , why do we need another level , everything I see with European management is overmanned and expensive

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Originally Posted by Lewis McColl

So Rob should we pull out of NATO then? as you say we have our own armed forces, but if the politicians keep cutting back, while at the same time sending young men & women to wars that have bugger all to do with the UK ??

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John sorry but that is a weak argument , check history when was the last time you can remember that the UK was not involved in some war somewhere. Perhaps if the UK were in a European Army we may not be so trigger happy. Look at the mess intervention in Lybia .

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###perhaps the recent referendum shows the majority in great britain dont want anything regarding unelected foriegners holding any sway whatsoever ...and even more importantly a carte blanche over our armed forces the shape of our bananas where we can fish or anything else......and to be honest i dont think the people here in general give a monkeys about libya......surely after the recent debacle they can sort themselves out.....but then that is my view .....as for trump giving us the dump ...i would suggest europe in general is costing him billions why does he need europe......certainly not for oil or gas ......china is his toothache now and will be for a longtime to come ......cappy

How would a federal army be funded, very similar to the funding of the EU i suspect, ie Germany being the biggest contributor , followed by guess who, we already pay into the EU budget as much as France Belgium and Holland put together, and in the end would be outvoted on how these forces would be run. I think we have already lost too much to Europe without giving even more away, just my view kt

I have seen how Greece takes EU funding for infrastructure projects , a joke ! , the armed forces of Portugal , France no problem but some of the others like 20 of the 27 never

Once you give up control of your armed forces you cease to be an independent country, which of course is what the EU wants.
Do you think the EU army would stand up to Putin, no of course it wouldn't.
Norway is Independent Russia last time I looked hadn't been invaded by the Russians.
As it wars Lewis, who caused the Ukraine crisis, the EU did when it tried to woe the country when Baroness Ashton stuck her unwanted nose in.
Vic

What would the language be in a eu armed force,???
The frogs would want the language in French,
the krauts in german and so on. Orders would be all mixed up. translations from one language to another would have different meanings ,
Total chaos.
The French do not have a good battle record. I saw that after the battle of Dien Bien Phu in Viet Nam when we had to go and rescue the survivors,
Not one thank you from the French government after three days and nights under fire rescuing the 2,500 survivors from the beach, and taking them back to Algiers and Marseilles

A European Army!!! Gawd can you imagine it.
The Germans would demand to be its leaders because,
A. They had the most recent experience in starting a war ( not too successful in winning, but hey we can't all be perfect)
B. They make the best cars in the world ( think staff cars).
The French would
A. Demand the strict 35 hour working week regulations were followed
B. French wine be included in all meal packs as it's the best
C. French couture houses design the uniform as they are the best
The Spaniards would demand a daily 3 hour siesta.
The Italians would argue that
A. They should always be the rearguard in order to make a quick escape should it all go tits up
B. They make the most stylish staff cars
C. The Italian fashion houses should design the uniform as Italian fashion is the most stylish.
( Which ever country won that argument, the manufacturing of the uniforms would, under strict E.U. competition rules, would be outsourced to a Bangladesh sweat shop operator and delivered by the lowest cost shipping container outfit possible, whose vessel would-be arrested in the Suez canal for non payment of crew wages, or collide with an Italian skippered cruise liner in the med.
The Greek army would despair that the uniform did not include white hosiery and frilly skirts
The Portuguese would only want to fight in Brazil as then all the natives would understand them
The Belgian army would have internal disputes between its Flemish and waloon factions.
The Dutch army would be very worried that any action taken would raise sea levels to such an extent that the dykes would be breached and even if they won they would only have a big lake to return too
The British army would ask for a delay in procedings whilst they settled the argument over who should have exclusive reporting rights, either the BBC or Sky.
Oh yeah, I can see an E. U. Army really working out....NOT.
LOL
Rgds
J.A.