Euthanasia

[Captain Kong]

Last week I read in the news that a 9 year old boy and a 11 year old girl, in Belgium, both had Legal Euthanasia.

I do not like Suiciders, they only think of themselves and not the people they leave behind.
When Anne had the Flower shop and I was helping her in my retirement, we had many suicide Funerals.
All were young people, never an old one. and the families were totally devastated by their actions.
I have seen people screaming to stay alive and these were just throwing away a life. It seemed to be a selfish action.

[j.sabourn]

How can an 11 and a 9 year old have such knowledge about death Brian. I assume there were extenuating circumstances in this case, otherwise we are living in a backward going society. If this is the practice in Belgium then the sooner we are out of Europe the better. The law as it stands may not be agreeable to some , but as soon as such laws get changed it is usually accompanied by a fall in standards. Just look at it the death penalty being revoked. Now there I would go along with compulsory Euthanasia. For those who promote Euthenasia for the old and infirm they can always go to such countries if they cantfind a sympathetic doctor in their own. Popiticians have already done enough damage of changing our laws and achieving nothing just heartache for some. I believe it is quite legal to Put in your instructions if undergoing an operation not to be rescusitated if stop breathing. So already the fiirst stage of euthenasia is already in the statute books. I think you would be awaking a sleeping lion by going officially further. Already a lot of deaths are assisted unbeknown to many. Let sleeping dogs or Lions lie. Cheers JWS

[j.sabourn]

Our history in the western world only goes back 2000 years. A minuscule of a split second in real world time. As a Christian society the basis of all our laws goes back to the 10 commandments which I severely doubt are kept today as they once were . They were from memory..
Thou shalt have no other God before me
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord in vain.
Remember the sabbath to keep it Holy
Honour thy father and thy mother
Thou shalt not kill
Thou shalt not commit adultery
Thou shalt not steal
Thou shalt not bear false witness
Thou shalt not covet they neighbours wife etc. etc.
That’s only 9 so. Have missed one out, not to worry though.
I would say that the average person could claim at the most one out of ten, that is they could possibly claim to send their mum and dad a birthday card.
How long does one think some of these ridiculous laws made by ridiculous people calling each other honourable are going to remain in fashion. Cheers JWS

[Trampshipman]

Ref your immediate reaction that it`s a cowards way out [though I grant that you do qualify that statement somewhat]. In some cases that may be true, but in many others it certainly is not. This is something which must certainly hinge on `Quality of life`.
Let me paint a picture of my own quality of life. I am 86 yrs of age and suffering [and I mean SUFFERING] from severe COPD, this partly self inflicted through smoking but caused mainly by some years welding under the worst possible conditions. I would add here that I started smoking when I first went to sea as a boy in 1949, and of course everyone at sea smoked in those days because we knew no better at that time, and of course the damage to the lungs was not apparent at that time. This damage typically does not become apparent until later life when everyones lungs begin to lose their natural elasticity. I have been severely disabled by this condition for quite a long time now. I have to struggle for each and every breath, and even the slightest physical effort causes me immediate great distress. I cannot stand for more than a few seconds and walking is out of the question. My poor old wife has to do everything for me, washing, bathing, dressing, the lot. All I`m fit for is sitting at my PC playing games or browsing forums etc, all of which I have long since become pretty bored with. What I`m trying to say here is that my quality of life is absolutely nil, just an unending ordeal of suffering and stress. I no longer have any real desire to live on in my present condition and I frequently wish that I was `out of it and gone`If only to relieve my wife of the burden which I know I have become', but of course if I mention such thoughts to her she she gives me `Down the banks`. Consequently I`m still here more or less playing at `Being a cabbage`. I`m not `laying it on` when I say that often just sitting and doing absolutely nothing is still something of an ordeal. I trust that no one will view this post as a`moan` or `a plea for sympathy`, it is not !!! I`m simply trying to make the point that someone wishing that maybe they were `out of things` does not really make that person a coward of any kind.

[John Pruden]

I for one have for a better word been through the mill strokes heart cancer but never ever felt like giving up every day I can spend with family is a good day. on the cancer wards people who had life saving opps that have not worked but we on the wards rallied around them gave them a little hope all I can do now is next to nothing but as long as I can I will wind you lads up and keep going till I drop my legs have gone got myself a disabled scooter got my freedom again I was at my lowest when my faithful fried went to sleep months ago I still miss him every day but life is good enjoy it? jp

[Rodney Mills]

Most of us were vey young when we went to sea and thought ourselves immortal. I for one knew of cancer and cigarettes yet I was sixteen and immortal, and wouldn't effect me, and a a tin of fifty "cancer sticks" was cheap. Them, having a yarn, reading and getting your head down was the basic form of entertainment at sea and cancer was for oldies. Well I guess 80 qualifies me as an oldie. I saw the light and quit cancer sticks fifty years ago.

[j.sabourn]

We have just had the body of an 86 year old recovered from a bush area who was missing for 4 days. The search parties have been looking for him for that time. The media has it that he suffered from Alzimers and dementia. However we will never know what if any his last lucid thoughts were. Did he know he was dying, did he regret dying, did he call on whalever Deity He believed in to. Save him. Only he and his unknown God will ever know. It is a risk that if you make it legal to take your own life , many in an unsound mind will take which is the same as condoning suicide. The family of that 86 year old I am sure are distraught at his death and would do anything to have him back, regardless of the state of his health. Whatever is decided about changing the law to legalise Euthenasia I see. Problems with. We have got by for centuries without what has changed.?. We already turn off life support machines, do not rescucitate if a patient so desires, I too have seen many men die but find it hard to visualise the Hollywood scenario where the wounded soldier says shoot me please. My biggest nightmare is my children and wife dying before me, that makes me a coward also,yet many have to go through that trauma and live to fight another day. I agree with John Pruden life is for living right up to the bitter end. Pain although unwanted is some people’s burden all through their natural lives, but there is always someone worse off than yourself. Cheers JS

[Les Woodard]

I agree with you John that as long as a breath in their body that they should strive to keep going and not advocating that it be any different. Therein lies the difference between us. We who want euthenasia made legal are not advocating that it become compulsary and those that do not want it have every legal right to not have it imposed upon them. One example I have in mind is my brother in law who for a long while was thinking of quitting life because of the problems he was having and his doctor was doing all he could to keep him going. Then he changed doctors to find out that the medication that he was on was excessive and the new doctor sorted it all out. Result that he lived many years more once medication was altered. So the arguments go back and forth with so many re arranged truths from both camps to push their own agenda. My point is that one can be relying upon doctors to keep you going but who knows if they are correct in their diagnosis, This is a case against what I believe in but still think that I want it legal to end my life if I so wish. Suicide may seem like a cowards way out but there are many reasons why it is not successful. If deciding to take pills ones body could end up rejecting them and you vomit them out hence why they recomend that you take medication to reduce the affect of vomiting before taking medication to end life. If one decides to suck on the exhaust pipe and someone comes along the chances are that they will stop it and no one can blame them as it should not be on their conscience either. But this could leave one with brain damage. There are numurous reasons as to why trying to commit end of life is fraught with failure that will leave one worse of. Maybe the only way is two ounces of lead or that fatal leap of the cliff or tall building which leaves a mess for the family to come to terms with. Personally would like to explain to the family why I am doing it and leave this mortal coil peacefully in my own home or hospital. Not being selfish just realistic in the fact that everything ends without undue trauma. Just one more point about an argument against it. What if the family are only interested in getting their hands on the inheritance and what you gone. Well if I thought that about my kids then there is no way that I want to hang around with them any more either. Just think of the ultimate revenge of not leaving them anything. No it is not a case stopping them changing the law just the fact that they are relying upon archaic religious rules to do absolutly nothing in case they loose a vote or two.

[j.sabourn]

Yes I can see both points of the argument. But as pointed out religion bears little relevance to the outcome. Morals or whatever you want to call of them are practically non existent. We rely a great deal on the medical profession , but even they have their duds. In a perfect world it would be everyone’s right to choose. But I wouldn’t mind betting inside of a year of making it so, there would be highway shops and mailorder kits on the internet and the ever present entrenapaurs would be there to put It into commercial terms. I like to pretend to myself that all life is still sacred. However that is being untrue as I agree with capital punishment . Whatever the majority want will in the end get. CheersJWS.

[Doc Vernon]

Most of us were vey young when we went to sea and thought ourselves immortal. I for one knew of cancer and cigarettes yet I was sixteen and immortal, and wouldn't effect me, and a a tin of fifty "cancer sticks" was cheap. Them, having a yarn, reading and getting your head down was the basic form of entertainment at sea and cancer was for oldies. Well I guess 80 qualifies me as an oldie. I saw the light and quit cancer sticks fifty years ago.

I am nearly there Rod .and I to Quit the Coffin Nails some 55 Years ago now, and after a Heart Attack in 99 I also quit the Booze! That was hard but I did it! You see I was at that time what I would call an Alco,not nice I know but true!
God I am so glad that I managed it! I am so much healthier and happier now days and have at least some cash in the Bank LOL And no debts at all,how wonderfull

And just a short one on the actual Subject at hand,i for one would not contemplate taking my own life I know we all have our own thoughts but that is just mine (But there again who knows what one will do if really desperate) Mmmm!!