The greatest Englishman?

[happy daze john in oz]

During the opening ceremony of the current Olympic gamescomments were made by the Australian commentators broadcasting here that made me take notice.

According to their sources the BBC had compiled a list of whom they considered to be the greatest Englishmen of all times.

Isambard Kingdom Brunel came in at number two. That in my opinion is a fair assumption as he did much for not only Great Britain, but also the world in general. His inventions such as the iron ships propeller driven were one of maybe his greatest achievements. He rates along side suchother great inventors such as Hargreaves in1764 with his spinning Jenny,Bessemer in 1855 with his converter, or Stephenson with his railway in 1835. In later years, 1936, Sir Alexander Fleming and his discovery of Penicillin. All were great men who did much for the world as well as Great Britain.

Then there were the great adventurers who discovered new lands such as Drake and Raleigh, or battle hero’s such as Wellington and Nelson. All are worthy of being considered as the greatest Englishman to have lived.

But according to the BBC the greatest Englishman was a politician by the name of Winston Churchill.

I for one, having read his life story, do not agree, though there well may be some of you who do. I will not detract from your opinions.
He was no doubt a great orator though there is doubt as to how many speeches he actually wrote and how many he delivered. He may have been the man of the day during the war, but so were many others. Was he a great politician or simply someone who enjoyed the situation? When his underground war room was opened thirty years after the end of WW2 papers were found showing plans for a war lasting until 1960.

It has been said all we owe the dead is the truth, so for me he is not number one.

I would consider men such as our own Lou in Dunedin to be amongst my greatest Englishmen. The men, who without question, went to crew the vessels bringing essential goods to England during the dark days of WW2. They did so on unarmed ships knowing there was a chance they may not return. Many made the ultimate sacrifice so their fellow man may be saved; some suffered the indignity and suffering of being Prisoners of War in Japanese prison camps. Butw hen the war was over continued to serve their country asking nothing more than a ‘fair go.’ Not for then the adulation of a grateful nation, no parades in their honour, and only in recent times a memorial to honour them. No pension or the golden perks that come with the office of Prime Minister. Now for all their efforts they struggle with a pittance of a pension, a poorly served health service and in some cases little to look forward to.

These I say to you are the greatest Englishmen, not some politician no matter how good he may have been at the time. I consider it to be wrong that an organisation such as the BBC, having an influence on the thinking of many people, could come to such a decision as to the greatest. I am not impressed!

[j.sabourn]

Like you have read certain parts of Churchills history. He was certainly appreciated during the war years as a leader and someone to look to. However his political skills and aspirations I suppose left a lot to be desired. His parts during certain strikes during the late 20" and early 30"s where he wanted to fire at certain strikers are well authenticated or were if they havent been removed. As I believe 1st. Lord of the Admiralty he made some very bad decisions re the Dardenelles. He was considered by the working man in the early 50"s as unsuitable for high office, so they obviously knew his past history. However he was a man for his times which were the war years. Regards John Sabourn.

[alf corbyn]

although the government will deny it,as they have to me on occastion, the BBC is owned and run by them; which is why we have to pay a TV licence. so it is only natural that they would promote one of their own as number one. although churchill was one of the better tories, he was a war corespondent in the boer war who was imprisoned and escaped from the boers, he was also involved with the capture of men of the IRA in the sydney street seigehe was still a polititian. (i will spell it right one day).

[Keith Tindell]

Hi Alf, you are quite right , he did escape in the Boer war, but in the book two other guys had discovered the gap in the sentries, where you could get over the wall. Churchill asked if he could go with them, but they said there was only time for two persons to get through, and said no. Churchill then nicked the plan, and went the day before the other two had planned the escape. Its all in the book KT

[Duke Drennan]

An interesting topic HD John, and probably a subjective one at that. I read both Martin Gilbert's and Roy Jenkins biographies on Churchill, both of them delivering the same facts. Whilst I acknowledge that he was responsible for events that, in retrospect, showed bad judgement, for the want of a better term, there's no denying that he stepped in at Britain's time of need especially in light of Chamberlain's weaknesses. The man had balls and I shudder to think of what might have happened in the wars years under another politician's leadership. Neverthe less, in terms of who could be called Britain's greatest person, I think, like you, we could name a few worthy of consideration. Just an opinion.

[j.sabourn]

Duke, I seem to remember in one of the books on Churchill, his father had syphilis must have been a rich mans disease then. Wonder how he got that. Must have been trying to keep up with other well known figures. Cheers John Sabourn.

[Jim Brady]

The greatest Englishman has got to be the man that invented Venetian Blinds.




If it was'nt for him it would've been curtains for everyone !!!!

Regards.
Jim.B.

[Keith Tindell]

I will agree Churchill was a great war leader, and what we needed at that period of history. Much the same as Maggie at the time of the Falklands, she was what was needed then, cannot see this bunch of school kids standing up to the Argies like that. Before i get a load of incoming, Maggie will also go down as someone who ruined our manufacturing industry, and fostered the greed *loads of money culture*, so cannot stand the bloody women. My opinion KT

[alf corbyn]

haven't read the book, but churchill was also responsible for the invention of the tank i believe. he started a competition which was won by ruston bucrus of grantham. i think the original tank is in the bovingdon tank museum, and i think was used or copied in the film "the last crusade"

keith. you forgot to mention that maggie was also responsible for people being allowed to buy thier council houses, and started the housing boom that went a great flop a few years ago, which led to a great shortage of council houses and also thousands of people losing their homes, thereby leading to todays homeless population. never trust a conservative.

[Duke Drennan]

Duke, I seem to remember in one of the books on Churchill, his father had syphilis must have been a rich mans disease then.

Yes John, his father did die of syphilis. I remember being on an L&H boat, the Defoe, in Jan '65 heading for Monte when we got the news of Churchill's death. We had 3 passengers on board, one them a padre and he conducted a service on deck to commemorate Churchill's life.