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Thread: Sea chest and painting information request

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    Default Sea chest and painting information request

    Sea chest and the Antiques Road Show.pdf

    The sea chest above belonged to a merchant seaman, my great, great, grandfather, Edward Coleman. His ship was the Airlie vessel 72545 built 1875 Iron sailing vessel 3 masted ship Built by Alexander Stephen & Sons Ltd. Govan. Involved in the Jute trade. It changed its name in 1899 to Superb.
    The ship Superb was sunk by a German submarine. The sinking of the ship happened 50 miles west of Fastnet. The Superb was a Norwegian sailing barque 1,393 tons and was built in Glasgow in 1875. She sailed from Buenos Ayres March 10th for Queenstown. She was sunk at 10.30 on Monday morning 14th of June 1915. Bombs were placed on her to make her sink.
    The Airlie was a famous ship and was painted by an artist John Henry Mohrmann in the 'Airlie at Sea'.
    On the inside of the sea chest, the painting of the Airlie, has two 5 pointed stars on either side I do not know what they mean? If anyone has any information on this vessel, or Edward Coleman, I would be very grateful.

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Hi Neil, Welcome to the site, can we have Edward's place and date of birth and death please and his rank if known.... to distinguish him from others with the same name. Thank you for the photographs

    https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?135476
    Last edited by Marian Gray; 21st July 2021 at 05:04 PM. Reason: Added text

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Hi Neil. Was your Edward Coleman born in Harwich 1850. If so he was not on the Airlie in1881 from Canadian records but coasting Petrel 11268-- Wellington 16754-- Mermerus 67904.
    There is a photo in the Victoria State Library of the Airlie as the Superb it is out of copyright, I did down load it but can't retrieve it will try later.
    The Airlie was owned in Dundee as the list.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Reference: BT 110/2/37
    Description: Ship Airlie, official number: 72545. When built: 1874. Registry closed: 1899.
    Date: [1891-1900]
    Held by: The National Archives, Kew
    Legal status: Public Record(s)
    Language: English
    Closure status: Open Document, Open Description
    Crew List for Ship here as well

    Crew List Index Search Results (mun.ca)

    Last edited by Doc Vernon; 21st July 2021 at 08:52 PM.
    Senior Member and Friend of this Website

    R697530

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Just for info

    There is an Edward Coleman as Merchant Navy Indentured apprentice age 17 at Grimsby 1882 for a 4 Year Term Finishing in 1886. ??
    Senior Member and Friend of this Website

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    AirlieUpload.jpg


    Thank you everyone for your input. The information I have on my great great grandfather as a sailor is as follows: Edward Coleman was born in Shadwell, East London in 1859. He was imprisoned between March 1880 to 1884 and so could not have been at sea between these dates. His marriage certificate in December 1888 states his profession as Mariner. The sea chest is from his ship, The Airlie. I do not know what the star shapes on either side of the painting represent. John Walker suggested that they may be a motif of a shipping line, but I do not know. If anyone can answer these questions, I would be very grateful.

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Not having much luck in finding Edward at present. Looking at the mariner symbols of yore, the black and white star in the centre apparently represents a nautical star and if painted on a red background means safe passage there and back, I think Hopefully the seafarers here will enlighten on whether I'm talking utter tosh as I'm way out my comfort zone here

    The abridged version below is copied from a Tattoo site:
    ''The history of this star is somewhat unclear. However, it likely derives from the importance of Polaris, the North Star. As Polaris appears to be stationary in the night sky, with other stars moving around its central North Pole location, it is a key reference point for navigation.

    In nowadays’ nautical charts, experts mark the position of North on a compass with a five-pointed star. Other maritime tattoo symbols deal with various destinations, or the voyage and its perils. However, the nautical star is likely the symbol of the return home or the lack that is sometimes needed to reach it.

    Because of its simplistic, but still eye-pleasing conception, the nautical star frequently finds its use in tattoos. Nautical star tattoos are said to keep sailors on course. As such, they also guide sailors home.''

    Do you know when and where Edward died please?
    Last edited by Marian Gray; 22nd July 2021 at 08:51 PM. Reason: Added text

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Have you a pic of the two 5 pointed stars feature in the PDF,
    Would be very helpful to pass around to others that may assist.

    Keith.
    "Our veterans did not forget about us .... Let's not forget about them." From Michael Levesque

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    Hi, Hi everyone,
    Edward Coleman died on the 23rd of January 1913, age 53 in Raine Street Workhouse Infirmary, London.

    Thank you Marian I found the information you provided on the 5 pointed star very interesting, especially as the story of Edward Coleman maybe in the next year the subject of a documentary and or book. It may be of little importance, but Edward (Ted) Coleman, led a gang in St. Luke’s, London called the ‘Forty Thieves’. The gang had a 5 dotted tattoo on the web of their left hand that showed they were a member of the ‘Forty Thieves’.

    My grandmother always told me that, Edward Coleman’s position was that of a First Mate, but I could never confirm this, as I never knew his sailor’s number. But I found this I found strange as a person of this rank lived in such poverty with his family in East London. But also I could not dismiss this as I’m aware that on a ship, space was so important and that his sea chest is so large. Therefore to be allowed such a large box onboard a vessel its owner had to be a sailor of high rank?


    more airlie pics.pdf full airlie art.pdf airlie star.pdf


    I enclose images of the Airlie's signal flags. I hope that these may help identify the owner(s) of the vessel at the time Edward Coleman sailed upon it. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

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    Default Re: Sea chest and painting information request

    I enclose images of the Airlie's signal flags and the star (in PDF formatting). I hope that these may help identify the owner(s) of the vessel at the time Edward Coleman sailed upon it. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

    more airlie pics.pdffull airlie art.pdfairlie star.pdf

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