Articles of Engagement

[Charles Webb Cooper]

I 'signed on' many ships during my time at sea and blithely signed the articles of engagement without giving them too much thought. I had a rough idea that I was signing my acceptance of a bond of behaviour and shipboard discipline in return for a specified monthly wage, but that was about it. Would it be possible for you to publish a standard version of the old time articles? I'm sure it would contain many clauses that would give any modern self respecting unionist heart failure!

[Des Taff Jenkins]

Hi Charles
I have a copy of the articles for the Vindi Sea School which in itself would but a squib up some of today's youngsters bottoms, but not the ships articles, where how much food, blankets bedding etc, what the ship owner had to supply. As you say I can see a room full of present day unionist laying unconscious on the carpet after it being read out.
Des

[Mark Keever]

Is November 27, 1944 old enough ? Click to enlarge ? Might be a start to help you along...

[cappy]

Hi Charles
I have a copy of the articles for the Vindi Sea School which in itself would but a squib up some of today's youngsters bottoms, but not the ships articles, where how much food, blankets bedding etc, what the ship owner had to supply. As you say I can see a room full of present day unionist laying unconscious on the carpet after it being read out.
Des

morning des ...sure would like to see those vindi articles .....guess they would interest a few other ex vindi boys on the site .....all i remember is no heating in dec ....no hot water for them morning ablutions and being hungry ,,,,,the vindi badge of course a viking longboat ....well if we were supposed to be bleeding vikings they had it spot on ....cold and hungary ....but it sure woke up us young guys ...and a bit of discipline stood us in good stead......looking back did me a power of good got me out my pit before the ropes end came lol ...in our hut e had some asian flu type thing ....codiene anny sure sorted us out.....do recall being in sick bay with half of our hut but got fish and chips in bed .....thought all me xmases.had come at once .....looking back wouldnt like it again ...but proud to be a ex vindi boy ...cappy

[Doc Vernon]

Can recall signing 2 Year Articles with UCL , but as said never even read it just signed . Too involved to worry at the time what was in it LOL
cHEERS

[cappy]

dont think i ever signedFG articles that were not 2 year ...but if you came back up to certain perimiters think brest was one of them they had to pay you off.....happily never did a trip like that ...8 to 10 month was usual........cappy

[j.sabourn]

Cappy if you were on the ore carriers you were probably on a 6 months running agreement . Cheers JS
As you were running back to the uk all the time all you had to do was give 72 hours notice in. However if you didn’t complete the 6 months agreement you were liable for your own travelling expenses home, if you left in Shields you were on a freebie. JS

[cappy]

yes john the ore carriers were on running articles i now recall but the tramps and FG tankers were of course on 2 year agreements ...but cant remember what theperimeters for the northern climes were ...ps snowed all night and morning...global warming ...lol regards R683532

[Ivan Cloherty]

#3, Thank you Mark, but those are USA Articles, our UK ones went into much more detail, (although haven't been able to expand yours enough to get the fine detail), even down to daily rations. As most have said Foreign Going Agreements (FG) were of 24 months duration before repatriation, but there was a clause that extended it to 26 months if the vessel was due to proceed to the UK after the 24 month expiry date, The other clauses that stuck in mind is that vessels were not allowed to trade beyond 65 degrees North or 60 degrees South, this was due to ice reasons, trading beyond those limits could only be done in ice strengthened vessels and an appropriate Addendum had to be signed.

There were other types of Agreements has already been mentioned,

HT Home Trade - Elbe to Brest
MT Middle Trade - Baltic to Bayonne
RA Running agreement - Mostly used in the regular runs of Colliers and Baltic and North Atlantic Ore Trades

NE RA North East Running Agreement - mostly used on the North east coast Collier trade routes

There may be others, but its coffee time

- - - Updated - - -

[j.sabourn]

I am sure Cappy there were some who did their full seatime in ore carriers and were never real 2 year men. The longest time away from the uk was usually 6 weeks , it was the nearest thing to a shore job going. For those on Bisco charters they were of usual 15 years duration and bareboat to British Iron and Steel which were a nationalised industry. So all overheads were paid by them or in other words by the British taxpayer that’s why the overtime was so good ,the shipowner wasn’t paying it. Although the two company’s I sailed with Dalgliesh and John I Jacobs , limited it to 3 hours a day, suppose they didn’t want to set an example for the future when they had to pay it. Some of the other company’s limited it to 4 and 5 hours , which attracted a moving community handing in their notices and going from company to company. The amount of maintainance work on an ore carrier compared to a cargo vessel is laughable really and was hard to find a reason to put on the overtime sheets . Those who think they were hard worked on such were never really at sea. Just poseurs . Tramping was where the real sailormen were. 2 years on and if necessary stop on. Cheers JS