PDA

View Full Version : Uk Shipyards



vic mcclymont
3rd May 2018, 06:55 PM
There is a myth that has been perpetuated over time that UK Shipyards suffered from lack of investment, that is not completely true.
Scotts’ and Lithgows independently of each other decided after WW2 that they would invest in their facilities, both decided that the investment would come from profits on build rather than borrow from the banks.
Lithgows owned three yards in Port Glasgow, Kingston and East Yard with a joint venture with Brocklebanks in the Glen Yard of William Hamilton.
With Kingston conversion completed in the 1960, they turned their attention to the East Yard and invested considerable sums in that facility.
In 1965 they approached Brocklebank with a view to modernising the Glen Yard, Brocklebank refused to commit any money to the project and the yard was closed, employees were transferred to the other two shipyards.
The Greenock Dockyard in 1958 committed millions of pounds to modernising the Greenock Dockyard, which was a museum piece, it had no cranes, sheer legs were used to lift steel plates. In 1962 the modernisation of the yard was completed.
In 1965, Appledore Shipyard in Devon was acquired by Court Line and became the first Shipyard in Court Shipbuilders. With yard under their belt, Court Line invested some £4m in facilities. The result was that the yard was one of the most modern factory Shipyard in the World.
With their experience of Modernisation, they joined forces with Lithgows to build a new shipyard in South Kore. Court Line would do the design and layout, Lithgows would get an order for two ships and would also train Koreans on how to build them.
In 1966 the Labour Government commissioned the Geddes report on UK shipbuilding, the outcome of the report suggested that yards on a river should combine in order to maximise economies of scale.
On the Clyde no one wanted to join the Upper Clyde yards that were notoriously under achievers.
The result was that Scotts’ (Scotts’ had taken over the Dockyard in 1966) and Lithgows combined to become Scott Lithgow, Yarrows sought to join the Lower Clyde Group, they were refused as it was thought or believed that this may impact on Scotts’ naval building in the future.
Meanwhile Court had purchased a number of yards in the North East and were in the process of modernising them.
When the UCS yards suffered cash problems Court Line sought to purchase the yards but were refused.
In 1977, the vast majority of the UK yards had modern equipment that was the equivalent of any yards in the world.
When Labour nationalised the yards in 1977, they had discussions with the Trade Unions, Labour wanted a 20% increase in output for no extra monies, surprisingly the Unions agreed. Labour also sought to remove 124 restrictive practices. The T.U refused. It wasn’t till 1984 they agreed to changes when it was too little too late.
Similar ships built on the continent were completed in 50% of the time it took a UK yard.

Vic

Lewis McColl
3rd May 2018, 09:35 PM
Funny how things turn round , the UK now has probably got one of the best industrial relations records in the world , certainly in Europe.
Possibly a big draw back today for UK employers is the standard of education kids are leaving school with. In the EU is only Germany, Malta & and Portugal have fewer strikes than the UK.

robpage
4th May 2018, 04:06 AM
I always thought the opening of the Nissan plant in Sunderland was a great turning point in 1984 , for industrial relations . no restrictive practices or overmanning . I felt that the membership lost control of the officialdom of many of the unions , the tail wagged the dog , i have been a member of a union for over 50 years , MNAOA , NACO (CO-OP managers) and now USDAW in retirement ,

happy daze john in oz
4th May 2018, 05:35 AM
The unions have in the past been good for workers, argued for better pay and working conditions which in many instances was warranted.

But now, certainly here in Oz, the trade union movement is a shadow of its former self.
Gov regulations and the fair work commission have made sure that workers are now paid correctly.
Health and safety regulations brought up to date with far less work place deaths than in the past.

But the younger generations have no time for them, they see them as something from a long ago past.
Not aware that many of todays benefits come from their actions.

Having said all that I have no love of them, they caused me problems with my pubs and restaurant in UK, and here in Oz made management of staff and conditions very hard at times.
But now for many, particularly the leaders, the union is just a gateway to state or federal politics.

John Pruden
4th May 2018, 06:00 AM
john when the act to buy you council house came in many hard line union members found that the bank owned their house not the corporation so ways had to be changed or you were out on the streets it was to me a crafty move by government to calm the unions and it did.. jp just my view?

robpage
4th May 2018, 06:55 AM
If that's the case John and I don't know if it is then I certainly fell for it and my wife and I nearly married with two small children certainly bought our council house , we lived in it for the mandatory five years and then we took a profit and sold it on to two people at the bottom of the housing ladder where we moved up and you never know I might just pop my clogs and leave this one to my kids or I might end up having to sell it off to pay for me to go in the old folks home so if that's the case I wonder what I work for has waited over the mortgage for for all these years

John Pruden
4th May 2018, 07:01 AM
rob you are not ready for the old folks home yet mate{they would not have you}:p:p jp

robpage
4th May 2018, 08:35 AM
still got most of my own teeth John

j.sabourn
4th May 2018, 08:39 AM
Which pocket do you keep them in Rob? JS

robpage
4th May 2018, 09:00 AM
Jam jar by sink

John Pruden
4th May 2018, 09:29 AM
my teeth were ok me gums had to come out?:p jp

Captain Kong
4th May 2018, 09:36 AM
Some one once wrote, that if you shoot a politician when you are ready for the care home, the State will look after you for Free in Gaol where you get better treatment than most care homes.

j.sabourn
4th May 2018, 09:39 AM
In Pisacap water? JWS

happy daze john in oz
5th May 2018, 05:45 AM
Mum and dad bought their council house with a 75% discount on market values based on some 25 years of paying rent.
Family later sold it when they had gone, made a tidy sum on it.

robpage
5th May 2018, 06:33 AM
We lived in Southampton and I can't remember the political changes that were going on at the time I was at sea and really couldn't be bothered to follow it when it got to about 1974 I believe the local labour councillors had started to bring a motion to stop the sale of council houses . When you read down the list of local councillors a huge proportion of them had purchased the houses that they lived in that it's one thing I don't care what colour your politics are or what your political Masters tell you to do but when you grab with one hand and then vote to shut the grab with the other I'm afraid that becomes total hipocracy . We got in very quickly and make sure the transaction went through before the local council managed to challenge the government ruling and turn it over

cappy
5th May 2018, 07:52 AM
###i always find this whinge about buying a council house a problem from the point of view whether it is sold or not ....if it is sold the capital goes to the council or to cut there borrowing from the banks ....or to bolster there over inflated pensions ....but it means another family are homed ......which is the purpose of the matter in the ist place .....the purchaser will soon find the difference in having to pay there own house insurance and council tax ....the cost of which will suprise them.....the protesters against buying cannot in all honesty say they would not do it if given the chance because it would stop someone else getting a house.....the true reason is they cannot in all honesty raise the capital and prefer to be a holier than thou or ..not even bothered iether way .....it was and is a great chance for people to have something of there own ....which will grow in value......but of course that is a political football of the left ......oohh they are taking something off us ..rather than they are giving something to us...i await the incoming....cappy

John Pruden
5th May 2018, 08:08 AM
cappy it was a very good idea buying your council house but like all political parties what was behind it all buy your house then poll tax on it? like many here do you can you trust anything done for votes?? without going into politics the power that is in number 10 would not be there if not for the referendum vote and look at the mess they have made of that? jp

thomas michael
5th May 2018, 06:10 PM
###i always find this whinge about buying a council house a problem from the point of view whether it is sold or not ....if it is sold the capital goes to the council or to cut there borrowing from the banks ....or to bolster there over inflated pensions ....but it means another family are homed ......which is the purpose of the matter in the ist place .....the purchaser will soon find the difference in having to pay there own house insurance and council tax ....the cost of which will suprise them.....the protesters against buying cannot in all honesty say they would not do it if given the chance because it would stop someone else getting a house.....the true reason is they cannot in all honesty raise the capital and prefer to be a holier than thou or ..not even bothered iether way .....it was and is a great chance for people to have something of there own ....which will grow in value......but of course that is a political football of the left ......oohh they are taking something off us ..rather than they are giving something to us...i await the incoming....cappy

hi cappy
you speak the absolute truth, as I can testify through personally having a family member whom was a ex merchant seaman, then straight on to the Mersey docks as a docker and ending up a boss until his retirement.
he was one of the first people I know to purchase under the right to buy due to Maggie thatchers government the problem was not with him, but his neighbours, they never let him forget of how he was a traitor to his class.
why you may ask, well just as you have stated he scrimped and saved to find that deposit, but his neighbours would never put themselves out in any manner, as they thought and still think that the system and the country should feed clothe and house them
tom

cappy
5th May 2018, 06:26 PM
###tom you hit a sore point for me ....the poll tax for instance was the most decent and honourable method of paying taxes to local authorities .....people living in a house with just one wife or husband paid two persons share we have houses now with 6 7 or 8 paying the same tax as two persons .....cuckoo land ...the latest one for me was a guy knocking on my door in the local elections ......he passed me a flyer ......i said which party he said labour ..i said no thanks corbyn and abbot enough said ...any way they say they will give everyone up to the age of twenty five free bus passes.....but who will pay ....dont worry he said jeremy will see us all right...lol cappy

Jim Brady
5th May 2018, 06:47 PM
#18 all the people I know never had to scrimp and save for a deposit for the right to by as a deposit was not required.Not many houses now on ex-council estates that are not owner occupier.
Regards.
Jim.B.

cappy
5th May 2018, 06:54 PM
#18 all the people I know never had to scrimp and save for a deposit for the right to by as a deposit was not required.Not many houses now on ex-council estates that are not owner occupier.
Regards.
Jim.B.

##well then jim if no deposit was required then anyone who did not take up the offer ....unless they were perhaps elderly......or on benefits would in my estimation be shortsighted to say the very very least.......cappy

Jim Brady
5th May 2018, 07:03 PM
Of course it was a no brainer not to buy it as the mortgage repayment could or would eventually be less than paying rent.
Regards.
Jim.B.

John Pruden
5th May 2018, 07:14 PM
up to a few months ago we had our son his partner and granddaughter living with us while they saved for a house deposit they did it all my kids work hard long hours for what they want 4 years it took them saving hard? trying to get a foot on the housing ladder is no joke these days? jp

cappy
5th May 2018, 07:22 PM
up to a few months ago we had our son his partner and granddaughter living with us while they saved for a house deposit they did it all my kids work hard long hours for what they want 4 years it took them saving hard? trying to get a foot on the housing ladder is no joke these days? jp

well john quite agree it is no joke but with the help of family and some true grit it is far from being impossible....ang the gains for all concerned are immeasurable looking back to my youth probably only new 3 or 4 who owned there own houses .....a great position to be in ....cappy

John Pruden
5th May 2018, 07:33 PM
cappy its handy with a family of builders? jp

robpage
5th May 2018, 08:20 PM
Unfortunately I think the generation now you're going to have the haves and have nots and I think some people are going to get on the housing ladder and do the buy to rent and some people are never going to get on the housing ladder no matter how many hours they work and how hard they work . I have just watch the Channel 5 programme which is rich house poor house where people change over houses and the vet changed over with a shipyard mechanic in Cornwall who was in a cycle of paying £500 a month of his wages back to credit cards the vet thought as he worked so hard and we're getting nowhere he cleared off 75% of the guys credit card debt and put a treehouse in the bottom of the two up two down house they had for his children it just shows you there are some real nice people out there

John Pruden
5th May 2018, 08:45 PM
rob we have a massive housing shortage but thousands of good builders in the dole lines ? they could be working yet we send millions every year to other countries i still cant get my head around this practice while there is one food bank that honest working folk have to use just to eat there should not be one penny leave this country to other shores we owe it to the taxpayers working on minimal wage? i got forms the other day for this PIP from the DWP 40 pages long and cant get help to fill them in some of the questions contradict each other i don't know if it is some sort of trick from them? the last doctor they sent to our house was the same consultant who's clinic i attend the stroke clinic the first words out of his mouth to me way what am i doing here he would get his few hundred for the visit is that supposed to save the government money don't think so and the time to fill out the forms will end well before they are filled in? jp

Lewis McColl
5th May 2018, 09:41 PM
I bought my mother her council house for her think it was about 30+ years ago , sadly she died within 18 months. I had a problem as I think the rule was you had to own it 5 years before you could sell it. My mum's next door neighbour was still renting her house. We had all lived together side by side from when I was a baby. Mr & Mrs Fleming always looked out for my mum. I got her to move in and let her live there rent free until she passed on about 20 years ago. I paid £12,000 for the house and I think I sold it for about £36,000. My brother and I fell out over it. When I bought the house we were supposed to buy it between us but at the time he said he could not afford it? When I sold it the cheeky fecker asked me for his share. So I asked him how he reckoned he was due a share? So he says deduct the £6,000 +£ 12,000 you paid from the £36,000, so that means there is £18,000 left over so £9,000 each. Never spoke to each other for nearly 5 years. He phoned to say he forgave me for being so greedy. Ah! well shall we say we do not share a lot in common. Lately as we are getting older the two wives are trying to get us get to on better. My brother is a very clever guy top of the tree in the Financial world when he was working, still very on the ball when it comes to making money. We have a difficult relationship.

Jim Brady
5th May 2018, 10:14 PM
Lew if you would have sold it within two years you would've had to pay the council 80% of the discount that you received on buying it.There was a sliding scale on what part of the discount that you had to pay back if you sold within five years.
Regards.
Jim.B.

Lewis McColl
5th May 2018, 10:20 PM
I knew there was something like that Jim, so as Mrs Fleming was not long widowed. I asked her if she wanted to move in so it was a win win for everyone as it released a council property for another family when Mrs Fleming moved into my mum's

j.sabourn
6th May 2018, 01:07 AM
I had two cousins who were brothers and a replica of what you say happened to them. The cousin who bought the house sold it and gave the money to my Aunts sister, when she died. The brother who supplied nothing towards the purchase of the house said he should have got it . The two brothers never spoke again. They are both now dead. When family fall out over money it is usually just greed at the source. No ones going to fight over mine cos I aint got nun. JS

robpage
6th May 2018, 02:08 AM
rob we have a massive housing shortage but thousands of good builders in the dole lines ? they could be working yet we send millions every year to other countries i still cant get my head around this practice while there is one food bank that honest working folk have to use just to eat there should not be one penny leave this country to other shores we owe it to the taxpayers working on minimal wage? i got forms the other day for this PIP from the DWP 40 pages long and cant get help to fill them in some of the questions contradict each other i don't know if it is some sort of trick from them? the last doctor they sent to our house was the same consultant who's clinic i attend the stroke clinic the first words out of his mouth to me way what am i doing here he would get his few hundred for the visit is that supposed to save the government money don't think so and the time to fill out the forms will end well before they are filled in? jp


I belong to a Facebook group that is dedicated to P I P there are an awful lot of horror stories out there but you can get help I would suggest that the Citizens Advice Bureau help an awful lot of people but I am sure that there are some people out there who can be a great help to you and I would start in your particular case John withhttps://www.stroke.org.uk/webform/contact-us I would personally use a charity called SIA which is the spinal injuries Association you'll find that all these people have dealt with this before our very very knowledgeable and as you say there's seems to be a lot of pitfalls in that form I got my award without attending any interview or anything based on the amount of paperwork that I put it in from Stoke Mandeville and from hobb's physiotherapists to a neuro specialists as well as letters from my GP etc there is a way to handle this and I would seriously suggest you talk to the stroke Association who will give you really good advice I promise you

robpage
6th May 2018, 02:14 AM
There is no such thing as good family relations when it comes to grabbing money particularly of dead relatives . I have it first hand from a manipulative family member who always managed to get her name on wills it's a long story and still painful but I could not believe that people in your own family when it came to money would stab you so hard in the back it's taught me that when money is involved you don't have in a lot of cases honesty but you have instead greed

cappy
6th May 2018, 07:59 AM
I bought my mother her council house for her think it was about 30+ years ago Never spoke to each other for nearly 5 years. We have a difficult relationship.

###surely if your mother was the original person on the rent book ...ok you bought it for her but it must have been in her name ....when she passed ....she should have possibly had a will which usually shares things equally between the children.....unless you had a note saying the money was only a loan ...your brother would have possibly had a case had it gone to court.....and of course anything can happen then ...just my view cappy

j.sabourn
6th May 2018, 10:36 AM
In my case I quoted Cappy it was my cousins stepmother who they thought of and treated like their own who died early in life. The step mother left the house to her eldest stepson who had bought it for her. The will was accepted and his brother received non of the cash from the sale of the house, why should he. He made no contributions when she was alive, why should he benefit from her death. The cousin who had bought the house spent a lot of time at sea and later here in Australia, so he relied on his step mothers sister to look after her, so passed the proceeds of the house over to her, she was more in need of it. As said no ones going to argue over mine as there wont be any after I’ve paid you back your 1/7d. Cheers JWS.

cappy
6th May 2018, 10:53 AM
###three and ninepence ......cappy

robpage
6th May 2018, 11:38 AM
Offering a 10 shilling note John might mean you can't find you any change although thinking about it he probably still got the pre decimal currency in his pocket

Lewis McColl
6th May 2018, 01:08 PM
Yes she did leave a will and she did leave the house to me, she also Itemised any jewellery I had bought her over the years as this was to go to my Karen. I was away at sea when my mum died and I never got back for her funeral. By the time I got back the house had been emptied. I may be the younger brother but when I called upon my brother and sister inlaw, it did not take long for the jewellery to be recovered. From the day I started work right until I got married my mum had first pick out of my wages and even when I went to sea she still got an allotment. For me it was always, my mum brought me up and looked after me so when she needed a bit of help I did my best to be there for her. Yes when as teenager I was a wild one and gave her many a sleepless night. My mum had a lot of mental health issues but for all that there was always a dinner on the table.

thomas michael
6th May 2018, 05:03 PM
###tom you hit a sore point for me ....the poll tax for instance was the most decent and honourable method of paying taxes to local authorities .....people living in a house with just one wife or husband paid two persons share we have houses now with 6 7 or 8 paying the same tax as two persons .....cuckoo land ...the latest one for me was a guy knocking on my door in the local elections ......he passed me a flyer ......i said which party he said labour ..i said no thanks corbyn and abbot enough said ...any way they say they will give everyone up to the age of twenty five free bus passes.....but who will pay ....dont worry he said jeremy will see us all right...lol cappy

hi cappy
I like you am of similar mind in regard to whom pays what, and whom pays nothing,
firstly to press my point let me say that I have seen enough and at first hand of the social and economic problems that dog the working class,both as a child and a young man brought up on fresh air with nothing, and because I dealt with that level throughout my twenty five years of being a private landlord.i can speak with honesty and sincerity,
my properties where throughout Liverpool and sefton and seaforth,all terrace houses. so if you like I became very familiar with the bottom end of the system ie the social and financial quagmire that is or seems to be the norm with the level we are discussing.
I have seen it all, you will never shock me about how people live or the condition they leave the properties, I have attended properties where at least three murders where carried out, so once again I only stress this to allow you to think of the scale I was talking about.
as for finance I have never ever ever borrowed monies to buy properties where I didn't have to pay something up front,and I have no need to exaggerate i bought my first property a terrace house in 1976, to re-house my mother it cost three thousand six hundred pounds and i received a grant of seven thousand five hundred pounds or there abouts to improve it.
again i make that statement as fact, as for buying council houses my brother whom i have already spoken of bought his back when thatchers government brought the law in, he still owns the house, he still lives in the house and his neighbours still have the same attitude towards him as they did when he first bought the house,
what does that say about his neighbours, that they have never moved on in thought or deed in all those years.
i rest my case
tom

Jim Brady
6th May 2018, 05:35 PM
Tom I spent 35 years knocking around council estates every day,from Marsh Lane,Netherton (dodge as well)Thornton,Kirkby,Huyton and Cannibal Farm and a few more to many to mention,different parts of the country as well,never seen a problem for the people who bought their council houses.You could tell where people were likely to buy, the whole street would buy and the area took on a whole new life,other areas where there was never a chance of re-selling so who the hell is going to buy there.After I retired I did up houses for landlords,they were delighted with tenants on DHSS,and advertised for such,it was gilt edge, rent paid direct to landlord from DHSS and then the a*se fell out of it the tenant was paid the rent direct to him,bit of a plonky or drug addict tenant gets all this money from the DHSS thinks it's Christmas and gos on a binge with the rent money.So it's not much fun being a landlord anymore I know a few of them and all they want to do is sell the properties.Yes Ive never known anybody that got hassle off their neighbours for buying their council homes,and anyway was there any reason to tell them that you bought it,they may notice of course when you start putting in new window frames etc.
Regards.
Jim.b.

thomas michael
6th May 2018, 05:46 PM
Tom I spent 35 years knocking around council estates every day,from Marsh Lane,Netherton (dodge as well)Thornton,Kirkby,Huyton and Cannibal Farm and a few more to many to mention,different parts of the country as well,never seen a problem for the people who bought their council houses.You could tell where people were likely to buy, the whole street would buy and the area took on a whole new life,other areas where there was never a chance of re-selling so who the hell is going to buy there.After I retired I did up houses for landlords,they were delighted with tenants on DHSS,and advertised for such,it was gilt edge, rent paid direct to landlord from DHSS and then the a*se fell out of it the tenant was paid the rent direct to him,bit of a plonky or drug addict tenant gets all this money from the DHSS thinks it's Christmas and gos on a binge with the rent money.So it's not much fun being a landlord anymore I know a few of them and all they want to do is sell the properties.Yes Ive never known anybody that got hassle off their neighbours for buying their council homes,and anyway was there any reason to tell them that you bought it,they may notice of course when you start putting in new window frames etc.
Regards.
Jim.b.

jim
some truth in what you say, the **** did fall out of the rental game when the rent act of September 1999 came into being.
as for council tenants I am not in any way disparaging their morals scruples or any other part of their lives,
I point out that there is a scum class that lives just below the surface and they hold the views that I have expressed, it just so happens that they are working class no marks.
by the way I did see your photo wth red ted and the French man, and I have seen ted plenty of times in the railway or the red lion and various other establishments in waterloo, and the same with you
tom

cappy
6th May 2018, 06:12 PM
###i have seen even on this site in the past people bemoaning the fact that some people had bought council houses ......what i say is anyone who could afford and didnt buy it ......were losers big time......as for renting property the choice is with the person renting whether to take a dump or not ...would anyone buy rotten fruit ......the landlord is seen as a grasping greedy person ...but the way some people live would put pigs to shame..... also paying no rent for months .....i had a case like that .....it was sorted pronto......dont ask me how ...i give respect and expect respect..cappy

- - - Updated - - -


I had two cousins who were brothers and a replica of what you say happened to them. The cousin who bought the house sold it and gave the money to my Aunts sister, when she died. The brother who supplied nothing towards the purchase of the house said he should have got it . The two brothers never spoke again. They are both now dead. When family fall out over money it is usually just greed at the source. No ones going to fight over mine cos I aint got nun. JS

##mary said you used to keep thousands of soveriegns in her wooden leg.....cappy

- - - Updated - - -


I had two cousins who were brothers and a replica of what you say happened to them. The cousin who bought the house sold it and gave the money to my Aunts sister, when she died. The brother who supplied nothing towards the purchase of the house said he should have got it . The two brothers never spoke again. They are both now dead. When family fall out over money it is usually just greed at the source. No ones going to fight over mine cos I aint got nun. JS

##mary said you used to keep thousands of soveriegns in her wooden leg.....cappy

robpage
6th May 2018, 06:16 PM
Doubloons , not Soverigns

cappy
6th May 2018, 06:21 PM
###no he kept his doubloons in her pantaloons .....but i am to much of a gentleman to say were he kept his pieces of eight.....mary had a cockatoo...cappy

Lewis McColl
6th May 2018, 06:28 PM
jim
some truth in what you say, the **** did fall out of the rental game when the rent act of September 1999 came into being.
as for council tenants I am not in any way disparaging their morals scruples or any other part of their lives,
I point out that there is a scum class that lives just below the surface and they hold the views that I have expressed, it just so happens that they are working class no marks.
by the way I did see your photo wth red ted and the French man, and I have seen ted plenty of times in the railway or the red lion and various other establishments in waterloo, and the same with you
tom

The name is Lewis just like to point that out!!!!

Jim Brady
6th May 2018, 06:30 PM
Cappy I must admit I have never heard anybody on here having a go at somebody for buying their council home I don't see the sense of somebody doing same.I own my own home from doing a six month trip on a King boat,pulled my horns in and did every hour overtime that was going.Yes in those days you could buy a little two up and two down for £350.00 £50.00 deposit that not many had.first little house gas and in a bad state of repair,my brother in law re-wired it and my dad set to work on it making it livable,I was on the 17 day trips at the time so everything was going on whilst I was away.Sold that little house for the deposit on this one.Had I been a council tenant I certainly would've gone for the right to buy.
Regards.
Jim.B.

cappy
6th May 2018, 06:33 PM
##did the same on the ore carriers lots of ovies beloved did the same we skimped and we struggled but we did it ,,,and it can be done today ..but many want all now ..at once .....that is the sad side of it ....cappy

robpage
6th May 2018, 06:39 PM
I always think that six months trips on a king boat must have been a very short trip sometimes they used to disappear over the horizon and not come back for over a year sometimes nearly two

Jim Brady
6th May 2018, 07:04 PM
You are right Rob she was four years old and had only done three trips,the trip before I joined her was 13 months.I had no option but to sign on as I had a DR in my book and could not get a job,I was not looking forward to it atall.A strange thing life isn't it,it was probably the best thing that happened to me joining her that is how I own this house now,fate is a wonderful thing.I have never seen a ship in such a state,the chf/stwd said the catering super said if she comes back in this state he is sacked,I said chief that is music to my ears you want her cleaned up I'm your man but there will be lots of overtime.She came back as though she had just come out of the builders,I was asked to join Clan Line as asst/purser chf/stwd which I declined.
Regards.
Jim.B.

robpage
6th May 2018, 07:38 PM
I did a trip on the King Arthur and I would say there are all for lot of people there who was cleaning up their discharge books it made a very interesting trip and strangely enough the May every time you had something to eat had to run and spend the afternoon in the toilet

John Pruden
6th May 2018, 08:42 PM
###no he kept his doubloons in her pantaloons .....but i am to much of a gentleman to say were he kept his pieces of eight.....mary had a cockatoo...cappy
cockor three cap??:p jp

happy daze john in oz
7th May 2018, 06:39 AM
Where there is a will there will be a relative you never knew of.

With council houses in south London at the time mum and dad bought theirs the local council had all the upkeep of them.

About two years before the law came in to allow the sale mum was told by a guy from council doing some repair work that council could no longer afford the upkeep on the houses.
Most were pre war and in need of major work in some instances.
Selling them was the best way for council to get out of obligations.

But the matter of the younger ones getting into the housing market, same here.
But it can be done if they put their mind to it, give up the smashed Avocado for brekkie at the local café and save a bit of money.

Many do get into it at the bottom and improve over time, but many want to start at the top, not possible unless you are digging a grave!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Peter Hesketh
9th May 2018, 10:54 AM
There is a myth that has been perpetuated over time that UK Shipyards suffered from lack of investment, that is not completely true.
Scotts’ and Lithgows independently of each other decided after WW2 that they would invest in their facilities, both decided that the investment would come from profits on build rather than borrow from the banks.
Lithgows owned three yards in Port Glasgow, Kingston and East Yard with a joint venture with Brocklebanks in the Glen Yard of William Hamilton.
With Kingston conversion completed in the 1960, they turned their attention to the East Yard and invested considerable sums in that facility.
In 1965 they approached Brocklebank with a view to modernising the Glen Yard, Brocklebank refused to commit any money to the project and the yard was closed, employees were transferred to the other two shipyards.
The Greenock Dockyard in 1958 committed millions of pounds to modernising the Greenock Dockyard, which was a museum piece, it had no cranes, sheer legs were used to lift steel plates. In 1962 the modernisation of the yard was completed.
In 1965, Appledore Shipyard in Devon was acquired by Court Line and became the first Shipyard in Court Shipbuilders. With yard under their belt, Court Line invested some £4m in facilities. The result was that the yard was one of the most modern factory Shipyard in the World.
With their experience of Modernisation, they joined forces with Lithgows to build a new shipyard in South Kore. Court Line would do the design and layout, Lithgows would get an order for two ships and would also train Koreans on how to build them.
In 1966 the Labour Government commissioned the Geddes report on UK shipbuilding, the outcome of the report suggested that yards on a river should combine in order to maximise economies of scale.
On the Clyde no one wanted to join the Upper Clyde yards that were notoriously under achievers.
The result was that Scotts’ (Scotts’ had taken over the Dockyard in 1966) and Lithgows combined to become Scott Lithgow, Yarrows sought to join the Lower Clyde Group, they were refused as it was thought or believed that this may impact on Scotts’ naval building in the future.
Meanwhile Court had purchased a number of yards in the North East and were in the process of modernising them.
When the UCS yards suffered cash problems Court Line sought to purchase the yards but were refused.
In 1977, the vast majority of the UK yards had modern equipment that was the equivalent of any yards in the world.
When Labour nationalised the yards in 1977, they had discussions with the Trade Unions, Labour wanted a 20% increase in output for no extra monies, surprisingly the Unions agreed. Labour also sought to remove 124 restrictive practices. The T.U refused. It wasn’t till 1984 they agreed to changes when it was too little too late.
Similar ships built on the continent were completed in 50% of the time it took a UK yard.

Vic

Really interesting article - thanks.
The first ship I joined was in Swan Hunters drydock in Wallsend in 1966. I was just 17 years old and on arriving at the ship was told by the Purser/Chief Steward that my job was to patrol the ship from 7pm until 7am to prevent the shoreside workers breaking into the bars and storerooms. (One of the bars had already had the shutters smashed in an attempt to get in) It wasn't the work I expected but as they say, 'It was character building'. The workers 'worked' all night, but it was soon clear that although there was a lot of noise, there weren't actually many workers working. The story at the time was one crew was designated to work and the others would spend more time in the the nearby pubs.
There was a very real animosity towards shoreside workers and especially in repair yards.
Was that only my experience or was it more widely felt?
Peter
Ellerman Lines (1965 - 1971)

robpage
10th May 2018, 04:19 AM
Really ?

cappy
10th May 2018, 10:21 AM
casualisation ,of employment is changing the face of the UK workforce and this is having profound effects on trade union membership.This is it put in simple term. Josh Jay Smythe

#rubbish there is less casual labour than ever ....as for the unions they are just a political front for the left .... ..in a few years the last of the union members will realise the union dues only go to two places the coffers of the left ..and to the bloated income of the union leaders to give them millionaire status while shuffling paper and having millionare lifestiles ...wake up and smell the coffee

John Pruden
10th May 2018, 10:53 AM
whats with the {CLICK THE THANKS ] to read a post

Keith Tindell
10th May 2018, 10:58 AM
You are obviously as confused as myself John !!!!!!!! As for post 55, the mystery man with many names ????, kt

robpage
10th May 2018, 01:16 PM
There is no mystery about schizophrenia it's just multiple personalities

Ivan Cloherty
10th May 2018, 01:24 PM
There is no mystery about schizophrenia

There is if you can't spell it!

robpage
10th May 2018, 01:30 PM
That part is easy Ivan I Ron all my heads through the spill chukka before I passed them on here and they Andrea system on the sing song galaxy starts it all out propeller and carrots all the beef steaks two milk it readable

happy daze john in oz
11th May 2018, 06:32 AM
There is no mystery about schizophrenia it's just multiple personalities

So which one are you today Rob? LOL

Doc Vernon
11th May 2018, 07:32 AM
I may be getting this wrong Gulliver but why must you keep on and on about one person on here!? As said I may read this wrong but!????


However knowing the peccadilloes of those two contemporaries it might just have been cattiness,but appropriate sentiments nevertheless about the persistent offender we have on here.....
.;)

Ivan Cloherty
11th May 2018, 07:40 AM
Think you may have got it wrong Doc, I think that Gullie is referring to a certain character who appears under different guises and different locations but all roads lead to Scotland, (used to be Rome). Don't think he's referring to any of our regulars, Gulliver is not the type of person who is reluctant to go face to face when necessary

Doc Vernon
11th May 2018, 07:41 AM
That is why I said I am not sure For goodness Gulliver!

Ivan Cloherty
11th May 2018, 08:21 AM
The mood is lost under such paranoia and distrust.
It does make me wonder on the merit of posting anymore.....

Forsooth, oddboddikins, avast ye harty on any such thoughts, such meritorious scribes are as yonself are surely needed on a site that needs such levity and taxation of our oft feeble thinking apparatus to lift us from some oft dire situations that doth befall us in this Sargossa Sea of infrequent misappropriation of thought that doth transcend upon us from time to time.

Spare a thought for this poor Yorick who must by default suffer the slings and arrows with one's first lady of fashion to set forth to some distant town and invaded milliners of yore to seek such suitable headgear to atop a dress she is not sure she is going to wear.......woe is me!

j.sabourn
11th May 2018, 08:59 AM
Easy on the taxation bit, Brian’s blood pressure is going up. As to the Liverpool man or his ghost I cannot reply to as like the real Liverpool man he is just a waif and stray and barred from my view as have banned him from my poor vision. His obvious rants don’t sully my screen. So can’t comment on as don’t know what tripe he is spouting. Gulliver your posts are much read by myself at least as there is always or nearly always a moral there somewhere. Be it only Bad boys deserve bad girls , have never found it worked for me though. Cheers JS.

robpage
11th May 2018, 10:20 AM
Gullible oh Gullible ward off the insidious desist from perusing the emotionally unstable, remember freedom of screech , Sojourn amongst us sceptics ,