Jealous, moi!!!!, too right I am

[happy daze john in oz]

#16, The " Fishermen's Friend cough lozenge and liquid cough mixture was first made at the Lofthouse Chemist shop located at the corner of Lord and Preston Streets. I was born at number 75 Preston Street and knew most members of the Lofthouse family. Just about every fisherman in the town called at that shop and bought a bottle of their cough medicine before sailing for the fishing grounds, and I have seen their products for sale in every country I have ever visited !. Regards Peter in NZ.

But Peter you must bevery careful which Fishermans Friend you suck on, get the wrong one and you could be in a lot of bother. LOL

[cappy]

First day of Cowes Week 31 July 1975 I was on watch bringing the ESSO Northumbria, 256,000 DWT, inward bound from the Gulf, 65 foot draft, we had Clear Channel, broadcast repeatedly on SPR , the Harbour Masters launch ahead of us, strobe lights flashing, loud hailer shouting ,` Get out of the Way`, I was on the whistle lanyard blasting away and not one yachty took any notice, they were crashing into us on both sides, masts falling over , people in the water screaming abuse. Yachts wrecked. I could not stop laughing all the way past Cowes and up the Thorn Channel to Fawley.
What a mess.
Kamikaze Yachties.
I had never laughed so much since the hogs ate my little sister.
Brian

###if i recall brian she was called big geordie .....sure was pride of the tyne on being built........cappy

[Captain Kong]

They have a large Factory now on the left as you drive into Fleetwood, The Lofthouse family are very big Doners to various schemes in Fleetwood. They have a BIG Export trade world wide,
Their biggest customer is Japan. This year I was in Townsville, Queensland and wanted a packet, I found them in a store there.
I always have a stock of a dozen packets of various flavours at home here.
Brian

[Captain Kong]

###if i recall brian she was called big geordie .....sure was pride of the tyne on being built........cappy

Hi Cappy,
she was Big Geordie, she was launched by Princess Anne in 1969. only lasted `10 years.
but she was a mess, very badly built, falling to pieces, the same as her sister ESSO Hibernia. always breaking down . the welds cracking.

We had three months in Cape Town because the rudder stock fractured ,
The Hibernia almost broke in half on her maiden voyage from the Tyne to the Gulf, only at sea for about four days., in ballast, she was towed stern first into Lisbon. and was almost rebuilt.
All the welds had welding rods stuffed in yhe gaps and then welded over the top.
They had two other sisters that were built in Belfast, same plans, the were very good ships, the ESSOs Caledonia and Ulidia, far superior quality building.
Two other VLCCs, ESSOs Demetia and Dalraida, were built at Kockums in Sweden, again far superior ships. Later the Demetia was hit by a missile in the Iran/Iraq war. and survived after repairs.
Brian

[cappy]

the shocking state of the northumbria and other vessels built on the tyne in that era answers the question regarding shipbuilding in this country and why the italians germans and french now have control of what was one of our biggest industries.....the old tyne riveters would have died of shame ....this another reason for the demise of british industry ........bad practices and men with no pride in there work .......cappy

[John Arton]

Cappy, Brian
The problems with the Esso Northumbria and the other super tankers built at Wallsend Slipway lie in its very name. Although the yard did have a large covered in dock where they could build ships in modular form, those tankers were just too large to be built in it so they were constructed piece by piece the old fashioned way using equipment that was out of date and in an era when industrial relations were at their worst. At high water the stern was under water almost so that gave only a short window of time when work could be carried out. The Government of the day had told the yards they had to embrace Far East building practises but there was no government investment in the yards to enable them to.
The only yard on the Tyne at that time that had the facilities that matched the Far East was Hawthorn Leslie. They had the largest dry dock on the Tyne, had invested in brand new fabrication shop where plates were cut using computer controlled under water cutting techniques, special heavy lifting trucks to shift 200 ton plus modules from inside the fabrication shop to the dry dock where they could be assembled. The dry dock could take ships up to around 100,000 ton size but only one bulker was ever built there.
The Harland and Wolf Esso tankers had the advantage of being built in the huge dry dock there where fabrication sheds were already in place.
The Swedish built ones were all built under cover and gradually pushed out from the covered fabrication shed as each section was added. The accommodation block was built separately and then lifted on fully completed at the fitting out quay.
There were only two yards in the U.K. that could build ships completely under cover in the 70's. A and P Appledore for small coasters only and the Deptford yard on the Wear where ships up to 25,ooo tons could be built and launched completely under cover.
Whether is was by government lack of investment or ignorance or by shipyard owners/managers not investing in up to date facilities and equipment the U.K. never had the proper facilities to build super tankers. Even the "Bridge" OBO's built at the supposedly purpose built yard at Haverton Hill on the Tees suffered similar problems in the welding as although the yard was purpose built for large ships it still lacked the most up to date welding gear such as computer controlled automatic welding machines etc. and specialist gear to align the sections. My next door neighbour in our first house worked on those Bridge boats and he told me that the only way they could actually make the welds was by filling the gaps with welding rods and then making the weld. The introduction of automatic welding gear was fiercely opposed by the Unions as they thought it would lead to the reduction in the number of welders required in the yard, no thought for the poor seamen who had to take them to sea. A pal of mine was on the maiden voyage of one of them and even on sea trials in the North Sea cracks were already appearing.
rgds
JA

[Captain Kong]

On the `Northumbria` we were outward bound fortunately in ballast, for the Gulf via the Cape. we Anchored off Cape Town and loading stores off a barge when the Barge Captain called me on VHF on the bridge to report that the Rudder was swinging about. I informed the Captain and Chief Engineer, The Chief got in a Bosuns chair and was lowered down and swung onto the rudder, The Rudder Stock cracked, he could get his hand inside the cracks.
We were then towed into Cape Town and moored alongside the outer breakwater. We ballasted the No.1 and 2 tanks and brought her down by the head raising the after end completely out of the water.so the rudder was exposed. We then had a One Metre Bend amidships, she was known in Cape Town and the big Banana.
Globe Engineering was informed and they inspected it. It was totally useless.
They had the option of, sending a new rudder stock down from the Tyne as there was one there. but that would take a few weeks , it was 75 feet in length and three feet in Diameter. Then they realised that there were no cranes in the Southern Hemisphere that big to withdraw the old stock and insert the new one, So that idea was out.
Next option was to get some ocean going tugs to tow us all the way to the Tyne to have the job done there and that would take around Seven weeks just for the tow.
Next option was to weld the stock fractures which extended most of the way all up the Stock. Big Job, these fractures were very deep.
So that was decided upon.
Scaffolding was rigged all around the rudder and welding began,
then the welds cracked again. then more welding , still the welds cracked again this was taking a lot of time.
So the Top Welding Expert of EXXON, Harry Ebert, was sent for from New York. He flew down to Cape Town.
After surveying the job and inspecting the welds, he had them all dug out again. and then rigged rings of gas jets around the stock.
So welding began again and the gas jets lit and this kept the welds hot and then controlled cooling began over a long period of time.
This method was successful the welds held and so that method was used all the way up. It took three months to weld the Stock fractures.
Meanwhile the Ship Manager had arrived in Cape Town and told me to make myself known to Court Helicopters and up date the Ship/Helicopter Operations Manual, which I did, I was flying with them daily and also at night, Servicing ships round the Cape with stores, crew changes etc and Rescues when ships were wrecked on the Cape and transferring prisoners from Polsmoor Prison, the toughest prison in the world, to Robbin Island.
It was an exciting job for the Three Months. I wrote about it in Seafaring Stories thread in the Swinging the L.amp Forum.
So the three months in Cape Town was well appreciated by all hands instead of a boring run up to the Gulf and back.
Cheers
Brian

[happy daze john in oz]

John #26, your comments about the Deptford yard brings back memories for me of my G.G.father. He was a riveter in that yard way back in the late 19th and early part of 20th century. His father had been a chain maker there, keeping it in the family.

[John Arton]

Re: my #26 Regarding the Deptford Yard in Sunderland, before anyone jumps in to correct me, the actual covered in yard is the Pallion Yard and it is still there but only used as a training centre these days. Some years back there was an outfit that was wanting to reopen the yard in order to build new ferries for, I believe, Indonesia. It all came to nothings as since the closure of the yards on both sides of the river in the area, no dredging had been done and the depth of water available had drastically reduced. It was claimed that it would cost over one million quid to dredge the river to sufficient depths to allow ships to get under the bridges nearby and no one was prepared to cough up so the scheme came to naught.
rgds
JA