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Thread: Construction of Titanic.

  1. #11
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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    Might well have done, who knows. My father was an apprentice fitter and it seems was all over the site. There was always huge competition among the apprentices to get selected for the one coveted place on the H&W guarantee crew that accompanied all new liners on their maiden voyage at that time. One apprentice was given it as a reward for their service and was highly prized. My father told me often how that topic was all consuming in the yard in the months leading up to the trials. "Fortunately" as it happens, he was not selected , the prize going to his best friend. He was lost with the entire H&W guarantee gang- and so, I'm here!! He completed his apprenticeship with them followed by a short apprenticeship at Brown's Foundry in Belfast before heading off to sea with Houlder Bros. as 4th Eng.
    Last edited by corrientes; 10th December 2018 at 03:09 PM.

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  3. #12
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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    Although he was a highly experienced and skilled seaman, Chief Officer Murdoch is sometimes mentioned as being the cause of Titanic's fate.
    One wonders as to why he and Charles Lightroller were demoted one rank lower while the Titanic was loading at Southampton. Henry Wilde was drafted in from the Olympic and made Chief Officer.
    Could having his nose put out of joint with only four days to adapt back to the duties
    of First Officer again affected Murdoch's decision making on that fateful night?.

    Fouro.

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  5. #13
    Lewis McColl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    Doubt it, was it not more likely to have been Ismay's insistence to run at full speed (at least according to the movie)?

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    I think that we are all subject to decisions in life and in some instances we react and no matter what our experience, we don't always get it right.

    They ( the experts ) say that an accident is a combination of events rather than one event on its own. The Titanic disaster was a good example of this - ' the unsinkable ship ' - ' the maiden voyage with all the razamantaz ' - ' the presence of Ismay on board ' - ' the chance of making a fast passage ' - ' the pressure on the Captain to do so ' and ' the less than satisfactory consideration of the ' Ice Warnings ' plus also ' the lack of binoculars for the lookouts ' resulting in the close proximity of the iceberg before it was seen. We must also not forget the possible confusion ( alleged ) of the helmsman as to the initial direction he turned the wheel following Murdoch's orders.

    The combination of all these factors brought about the disaster. I would not be too hard on Murdoch, he did what he thought best, in circumstances that were not of his making. We have all been there ( Deck Officers ) at some time in our sea going career when we have experienced that ' half a crown - three penny bit ' moment which fortunately turned out OK - with Murdoch it did not turn out OK and he has shouldered the blame ever since. The blame in my opinion lies with Smith who should have exercised caution and protected both his ship and crew from the pressures of the ship owners and their desires.
    When one door closes another one shuts, it must be the wind

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    #10 Ahhhh ! customs house Quay, and the Tail of the Bank, brings back memorys from that side of the water, and Ma Carols in Belfast where had my 21 st. On the other side . A good mixture there Lewis, the best and worse of two worlds. Now if you were born on the Stranraer to Larne ferry halfway across would complete the picture , what nationality would you prefer ? I was born near Iron Bridge and my mother used to hint that it was really in Wales. She was Scottish and my father English. So I cut the cards and call myself a Geordie. Who the Scots reckon is a Scotsman with his brains blown out. Two of my uncles were also riveters, when such existed. Lewis being the son of a Freemason and 18 years of age appearing in the meaning of, so you were probably named after whichever grandfather was such, who was probably your Scottish one. So you can always say you are 18 if anyone asks. Cheers JS
    Last edited by j.sabourn; 12th December 2018 at 01:29 AM.

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    #14... No matter what people come up with later in their own deliberations it is too late. The subsequent enquiry would have been and still is the official answer to the tragedy. These conclusions are made by people supposedly with the intellect to do so. However that sometimes is questionable , but not for others to reason why. All through history today we have people questioning the facts of the history books. Today if the Titanic occurred in present day circumstances the master Smith would be held totally accountable and if survived would probably have done time. There is always a fall guy in any accident. Human failure is usually the culprit blamed for insurance claims and the like . As regards blaming lack of binoculars seems very short sighted, the pun not intended, for those who have been in similar conditions , when ice is around long before you see it , there is a fall in temperature and one can literally smell it, so if anything it wasn’t lack of binoculars it was lack of experience if anything. It’s all very well to discuss afterwards, but in all events the total truth will be with those not with us today. JS

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    #13...That may well be nearer the truth than people realize Lewis. One time where Hollywood may have received good advice on how things work at sea. I was master of the Nordic Explorer a Norwegian seismic vessel working off the NW of Australia. We received a cyclone warning and all ships started to make a run for it. I told the camp boss and Englishman with an English team out from England , that I was leaving the area also. Let me say that those that came to work out here temporary from the North Sea had a false sense of their own importance. You can’t do that he said I’ve got four arrays out just stay here and carry on. I told him to get knotted he could start pulling them in now or do it on the way up to Broome where I reckoned I could get behind the front of the storm. I proceeded on my way towards safer climes. As it turned out the storm veered off its forecast track later and missed the area. He put in a strong claim that I wouldn’t listen to him, which I wouldn’t in any case. And had me removed, or at least I was sent to another ship after that swing there. I had the satisfaction of learning later that he had coerced the next master there to go too close to the reefs and lost hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost gear. The unfortuanate part about it was that the master got the sack and this spunk trumpet is more than likely around today telling people how important he is. Once again you can’t kick against the pricks of this world. I always adhered to the fact if you were the master the safety and welfare of ship and crew was your responsibility not other people’s . It may have lost me friends if you can call them that , it was hard going but I got full employment at sea for my whole working life , even though some of the jobs were those that others wouldn’t take. JS
    Last edited by j.sabourn; 12th December 2018 at 03:33 AM.

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    I have seen , so many times on cross channel RO/.PAX , they were a serious problem over force 9 , always damage and complaints , in the lee of the IoW the weather was disregarded by Superintendents deck and engine , always keen to sail , commercial decisions , but never offered to sign on and sail out , I suspect Capt, Smith had a lot of blue ribbon on his back put there by Ismay
    Rob Page R855150 - British & Commonwealth Shipping ( 1965 - 1973 ) Gulf Oil -( 1973 - 1975 ) Sealink ( 1975 - 1986 )

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  17. #19
    Lewis McColl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    Quote Originally Posted by j.sabourn View Post
    #10 Ahhhh ! customs house Quay, and the Tail of the Bank, brings back memorys from that side of the water, and Ma Carols in Belfast where had my 21 st. On the other side . A good mixture there Lewis, the best and worse of two worlds. Now if you were born on the Stranraer to Larne ferry halfway across would complete the picture , what nationality would you prefer ? I was born near Iron Bridge and my mother used to hint that it was really in Wales. She was Scottish and my father English. So I cut the cards and call myself a Geordie. Who the Scots reckon is a Scotsman with his brains blown out. Two of my uncles were also riveters, when such existed. Lewis being the son of a Freemason and 18 years of age appearing in the meaning of, so you were probably named after whichever grandfather was such, who was probably your Scottish one. So you can always say you are 18 if anyone asks. Cheers JS
    On my fathers side they were all masons, my brother is or was a mason. My Christian name Lewis is actually my mothers maiden name, although when I was approached and invited to become a mason. I declined. It is not that I have anything against the Masonic it was just that it was not something I wanted to be part off. I know this though that when my Dad died and left my mum a young widow the masonic looked out for my mum for many many years. Scottish or Irish!!! oh I am fond of the Scots but I am 100% Irish.

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    Default Re: Construction of Titanic.

    #18 The biggest danger at sea Rob and was probably the same ashore, was the fear of losing your job held over your head. At our ages and waning life expectancy there is no fear of speaking the truth now, others might benefit by simply telling it really as it was. Loyalty was giving away in lots of cases undeservedly, let’s make no bones about it. We protected at Times dim witted bosses who had no intention of returning the favour. That may be whistle blowing and if anyone of those who have been whistled on they should question the facts for a few more. JS
    Last edited by j.sabourn; 12th December 2018 at 10:11 AM.

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