PDA

View Full Version : Rule of Law



John Albert Evans
18th August 2012, 05:01 PM
The people running this country, Politicians, Lawyers and Civil Servants really are a joke.

On 24th February 2012 Julian Assange appeared before the Courts in this country and a warrant was issued for his deportation to Sweden for serious sexual offences.

He is also wanted for offences in the USA.

Neither of these allegations have anything to do with this country. He used the Criminal Justice system quiet legally to appeal the deportation order. His appeal was dissmised on 30th May 2012 by the Supreme Court.

For the life of me I cannot understand why there were not two Police Officers at that hearing and knowing that his appeal had been disallowed he was not immeadiately placed in handcuffs, taken straight to Heathrow Airport put on board the first plane to Sweden. This would have been a completely lawfull act.

What have we now, we have the whole world witnessing the farsical situation at the Equador Embassy in London and not one person in authority has a clue as to what to do.

It's no wonder we are the dustbin of the world. Leadership is a joke. Doesn't it just make you proud to be British.

John Albert EVans

Chris Allman
18th August 2012, 06:12 PM
John I could not agree with you more. We appear to have the biggest buffoons in history involved in our government and legal systems. I bet the Police are heaving a sigh of relief that Stuart Hazell was arrested as quickly as he was over the murder of Tia Sharp. Why he was allowed to go when he was obviously under suspicion was a real bollock dropped.

Chris.

Jim Brady
18th August 2012, 07:26 PM
Another interesting statistic since 2010 we have provided 3.3 million assistance to Ecuador I know this is not a lot of money but just how many foreign governments are we giving money to.All these amounts albeit its not a lot but all these little amounts add up.The money we spend on Ecuador does not buy us any influence.They just despise us for it.And with international relations it is clear you can't buy friends either.
It is possible using the 1987 Consular Premises Act to lift Ecuadors diplomatic status.Which I imagine means that we can go in and arrest this character.
Regards.
Jim.B.

Captain Kong
18th August 2012, 07:26 PM
Hague has not got a clue. He threatened to enter an Embassy, which is illegal, the whole of South America is now against us, how many export orders will now be cancelled?.
So far the stand off outside the Embassy has cost us Tax Payers over 1,000,000 and we are supposed to be short of money.
All this has nothing to do with Britain.
He is an Australian citizen, wanted in Sweden and in the USA, just leave it to those three countries to sort it out.
He was in the Embassy, just let the Ecuadorians feed him , not costing us anything. Simple.
.
It was Hague only last week gave 5,000,000 of body armour and sophistcated radios to Al Quada and Taliban backed soldiers in Syria, when our own soldiers are crying out for decent equipment. One Guardsman killed today by the same organisation that Hague has given body armour to when that may have saved the life of the Guardsman.
Cameron is on holiday in Greece and the deputy PM is on holoday in Spain and Hague making a cock up in London.
Why can the public not get these Politicians sectioned under the mental health act.
Brian................now definately back on the whisky.

Captain Kong
18th August 2012, 07:29 PM
Jim, we give aid to 185 different countries.
Brian

Chris Allman
18th August 2012, 07:32 PM
now definately back on the whisky.

Brian I wish I was but unfortunately cannot touch the stuff till Christmas. :( I have to agree with everything you said, but the other two would not have fared much better, they are even bigger plonkers.

Chris

happy daze john in oz
19th August 2012, 07:29 AM
In reply to #1 he was let out on bail and there were still some avenues of appeal open to him. He is now guilty of jumping bail by seeking asylum in the embassy. The Australian gov can do nothing as he has not breached any of our laws. A precident was set back in 1987 where by the UK gov can order the storming of an embassy if they consider there may be a threat to national security involved. The fact is this Richard Cranium could have gone to the Australian embassy and handed himself in . But no matter where he is there is no way out for him, he will be arrested as soon as he sets foot outside the embassy. From comments here in Oz today I believe the Oz gov would like to see him extradited to Sweden.

j.sabourn
19th August 2012, 08:54 AM
I cant see why all these left wing and freedom of speach weirdos are getting their knickers in a twist over. How about the 2 girls who are accusing him of sexual aggravation or whatever, do they have no rights? If he is innocent he has nothing to worry about as will be found so and will be free to go. Seems to me has a guilty conscience over the same and is using all this hype over the US wanting him and using this to dodge his lawful responsibilitys. To me the man has no morals whatsoever. If America or any government were really keen to get him, he would have been long gone. Just a gutless worm with no backbone like some of his disciples. Cheers John Sabourn

Keith Tindell
19th August 2012, 09:49 AM
I think from our point of view, its the perfect scenario, hes as good as being in prison, robbed of his freedom etc, and not costing us a penny. And if they were to smuggle him out of the country etc, even better, hes out of our hair . Its pratt politician causing all the hassle. KT

Tony Wilding
19th August 2012, 01:18 PM
Am not condoning what he has done and is accused of, dont know what he is guilty of untill proven, but he is not a threat to National Security, but to storm the Embassy is not right, could mean the end of save haven for all worldwide if its allowed, i find it strange the USA have said thet dont want to Extradite him, more in this than is stated. smells fishy to me.

John Albert Evans
19th August 2012, 01:41 PM
Am not condoning what he has done and is accused of, dont know what he is guilty of untill proven, but he is not a threat to National Security, but to storm the Embassy is not right, could mean the end of save haven for all worldwide if its allowed, i find it strange the USA have said thet dont want to Extradite him, more in this than is stated. smells fishy to me.

Tony I agree with you thats it stinks, but what I would like to know is the name and position in government of the person who suggested entering the Embassy in the first place. Surely, Surely that person must have know that it would be completely illegal to do that and the repercussions throughout the world would be too serious to contemplate and if that person didn't know that then he should be sacked but then we enter another minefield brought upon us by our politicians.

John Albert Evans.

PS Please excuse the rant:mad:

Chris Allman
19th August 2012, 02:03 PM
John, as said before in this thread, the present regime appears to be full of plonkers, ( nothing has changed then ) who take the brake off their mouths before putting their brain, if they have one, in gear. You never learn who these spokespersons are and everything is either hushed up or hidden behind some national event like the Olympics. If politicians put the energy that they put into deceiving people into properly serving the people and their country, you would see a big improvement in things. Alas this will never happen so our biggest decision is always which set of plonkers do we elect who will do the least damage to our lives.

Chris

Tony Wilding
19th August 2012, 02:38 PM
Agree with all that has been said, the problem is whoever we vote for , once in Power they do there own thing, there economic plans are not working, yet Cameron states he will not change tactics, i think it was Captain Kong who stated we are giving Aid to 160 Countries, how can we do that in deep recession, when services are being cut here,? all lost money, but making some very rich people who receive this Aid, this Aid has to stop, Virgin Trains now being taken over,that means high fare increases to pay shareholder dividends, the passenger is fleeced more. Indian Railways all State owned, 8 price structures, even a Beggar can afford Rail Travel, the teenagers are not finding work, will grow up with all the wrong ideas,

John Cassels
19th August 2012, 05:32 PM
There was a time when politicians were executed for incompetence.

They accept a job , they get well paid and accept all the rest of the benefits. If they fail , why
should they get off scot free ?.

john sutton
19th August 2012, 07:17 PM
Just as an aside with reference to politicians.We are all aware that the scottish parliment cost 400million pounds rather than the 40 million quoted.Apparently this was due to extras requested and as we all know once you ask for anything that was not on the origonal quote the contractor has open season.One of the items was a glass walkway so the members would not get wet between buildings.This information comes from a contractor that was involved in the scheme
john sutton
PS if you are scottish and thinking of giving this lot carte blanch,beware

John Albert Evans
19th August 2012, 07:38 PM
How can it be right for Gordon Brown the last Prime Mentalist, to be entitled to claim for this year to date 20,000.00p in air fares alone from Scotland to London, it cann't be Parliamentary Business as hes only been there three time this year.
Im relying on this information from the press.
I may be jumping the gun but after Lord Levenson has had his say, he may severely curtail what the Press can report and print which means that whichever party is in power they will have carte blanche to do whatever they want without fear of getting caught and by jingo wont they take advantage of it.

John Albert Evans

Jim Brady
19th August 2012, 07:53 PM
John Albert,20 Million for three trips seems a bit severe.Was that in the Daily Mail,one good comic!!!!!
Regards.
Jim.B.

Tony Wilding
19th August 2012, 08:34 PM
20,000, 00p is twenty thousand , not enough zeroes to be millions.

Ivan Cloherty
19th August 2012, 10:50 PM
20,000, 00p is twenty thousand , not enough zeroes to be millions.

Also John has printed it correctly as 20,000.00 (twenty thousand) and Tony has done it Continental style 20,000,00 (twenty thousand) which can get confusing at times but they also use 20.000,= which is more confusing :smashPC:

j.sabourn
20th August 2012, 06:25 AM
Agree that whoever came out with storming an Embassy is talking out of a hole in their rear end. Probably the illustrious press misquoting someone. These little tin pot central american countries arent worth the bother, the only thing they produce for general use is illicit drugs. Let him go and spend his life there if he so desires, I certainly couldnt care less. Have his trial in camera re. his sexual abuse case. Whatever money he has will go to his protecting officials in the country of asylum, hope he has a nice life. Cheers John Sabourn

Ron B Manderson
20th August 2012, 07:51 AM
Well chaps and chapesses.
We have to be very carful e here.

Our dear friend the arab (hooky dooky) we can't send back to Jordon. + others. Why? because he faces the death sentice
Who in their right mind trust the americans.
Look at the whole shooting match.
In sweden he was found not Guilty of the sex charges so that is finished. Or was it .Is this new charges or just made up.
I don't think that Sweden will stand up to the U.S.A and will transfer him at the first moment they can.
This lads website showed that america was telling porkys. Nothing new there. The shooting of all these people in the street from the air.
To me if someone does anything bad against USA they are wanted by the usa.
The young uk lad that broke their code and went into their computors is wanted over there now. Even if he is not the full shilling.And can get 100 years in jail.
The whole trouble is that USA want's to rule the world. I think we have all seen that on our travels.

Lets face it . The embassy threat. How stupid can we get. Start that and tit for tat will start.

What? will we send a gun boat to south america. These days are passed.This country is living in the past.

All this secret jails and flights in the night.etc the USA has got, is not real.
Hitler tried and failled
Human rights.??? The americans have kept a young soldier in soll confiments for 800 days now . Without charge remember.
What about his rights.
Me !I'm glad that a small country has stood up to the bullies.
I have studied the case at lenght. so I say" just think if it was your son ."
To me it is all lies and bull.
Now the arabs are wanting the oil money changed from dollars so will USA want to get hold of all the arab leaders ?
It is time the truth is brought out .
The only thing that wikie did was show the world the truth about the super powers and all the lies they have been telling the world.
Time they stopped interfering in other countries
Get off the soapbox now Ron.
Ron the batcave

happy daze john in oz
20th August 2012, 08:33 AM
A few other facts. the embassy can be invaded by British if it poses a threat to the system, see the 1987 incident. The embassy is only one small suite in a very large building, if he stays there he will have litle more room than in a prison cell.
But here is a good one for you. Here in Oz there has been an enquiry into the press, the Labor party saying they have too much power and keep bagging them. The report has suggested some controls on the media. But one Labor left wing back bencher has come out and said that any journalist twho tells a lie should bve fined or worse.
All well and good, but if I recall were not similar situations occuring in certain parts fo Europe before WW2?
How do we distinguish between a lie and the truth in the media, many a time govs will put out mistruths for their own gains. How do we treat that situation. Once you make any attempt to stifle free speech then you are at the end of freedom as we know it. Beware big brother is certainly watching you now!

Captain Kong
20th August 2012, 09:43 AM
But one Labor left wing back bencher has come out and said that any journalist who tells a lie should be fined or worse.
HD John.
.
Hi John,
Thats a bit of a laugh coming from a Pollie, That would mean All Pollies would be in trouble, they neve stop lying.
Cheers
Brian.

j.sabourn
20th August 2012, 10:09 AM
Propoganda is usually considered a legal weapon in warfare. e.g. Dr.Goebells and Lord Haw Haw. We also had ours as well I suppose. However the politicians must have thought this was too good an instrument in peacetime to take in what I suppose they consider the ignorant masses. However once they have been caught out they loose any sort of credability. This happens all the time nowadays, this is why it is always very refreshing to find an honest politician nowadays, which is very rare, an honest one is worth their weight in gold. The number of lies and plain outright alteration of the truth seems to be the norm for some of them. For a politician not to have the press on their side is also a death knell politically for them. However since the advent of the internet we are not now completely reliant on a newspaper reporter to put his often biased views forward which was to a certain extent another form of propoganda. If I thought for one moment that the bloke hiding in the foreign embassy was fearful of his life as he claims I would be all for him. However he is to me another newsman in a different way ready to put other peoples business on the air, in which case he should not mind himself being subject to other peoples views on his actions. Regards John Sabourn.

Minstrel
20th August 2012, 12:32 PM
Why not have him tried "in absentia" in Sweden. Then if he is found guilty and sentenced by this means issue an International warrant for his arrest.

A simple solution to this fiasco!

Minstrel

John Albert Evans
20th August 2012, 01:02 PM
What a sensible suggestion.

John Albert Evans

Ivan Cloherty
20th August 2012, 02:51 PM
Agree with John Albert, a very sensible proposal Minstrel, but it may be against his "uman rites" as there will be some bent lawyer jumping on his bandwagon and using our money for legal aid, that's how daft it all is now. The ones born here, paid their taxes etc etc wouldn't get an a pennyworths of help in a similar situation.

Ron B Manderson
20th August 2012, 08:33 PM
Lets look at it another way.
Don,t you think it is a bit funny that the charges of sex offences only came out after america wanted him.
I don,t know if he did these things are not. If he did then agree go to trial But to me it stinks.
My brother who deals with Goverments around the world say that there is more coruption in UK and the west , than in the whole of Russia.
When my older Brother was signing a contract in USA he had to go tyo meet the Secret Service. The first thing they asked If his younger brother was Bruce. When he said yes he was told that they didn,t like his politics. Answer was " I am not my brothers keeper." So in other words If the uSA don't agree with you , your bad.
We have all seen that sort of thing while travelling.
I remember while on The MV markor we arrived in BERBERA.Red Sea. At the time we were in that world weather rubbish ( they tell to give noon position in case trhey had to fly a doctor to us. Did we believe in that tale NO!
When we arrived in port the old man had been asked to fill in a form ( by the usa world weather). Important things for the weather I'M sure.
1 How many dockside berths
2 Any russian ships about in port
3 A what kind of radar do they have aboard.
4 do they have bunkering there.
5 how many cranes on docks.
6 how deap is the water in harbour.


Yes all to help the forcaste of the weather.
The old man did not fill it in .

So lets face it we are all told lies from all around.

Ron the batcave

j.sabourn
20th August 2012, 11:46 PM
What you mention about ship reporting has been ongoing for many years. In Australia is called Ausrep and in States something else, is to coordinate any search and rescue ops. which may arise. Regards John Sabourn

j.sabourn
21st August 2012, 12:22 AM
Ref. previous may have misread post about world weather reporting. As regards Ausrep I think is still in force, every ship within certain limits of Australia must report in every 6 hours, course, speed etc. this is mandatory and applies to all vessels. If a report is not sent in SAR may be put in motion that the vessel is in distress. In this day of satellite observations etc. may seem a bit outdated, but certainly most ships know that any discharging of oil etc. can soon be traced to them. Looking on the lighter side of it, the illegal boat people are observing the letter of the law when they are phoning Canberra and asking for a lift. I would suggest however this does not make them law abiding future citizens. Getting back to Julian Assange, I think it a bit far fetched to suggest that Sweden is in collusion with the USA in order to get the whistleblower back to the states, I feel that the person in question is living in his own world of self grandeur. As said previously if the suggested secret services of the US ( which there are many) wanted him he would be long gone. Regards John Sabourn

happy daze john in oz
21st August 2012, 07:10 AM
Now hear this, the sexual assault charge comes because in Sweden it is illegal to have sex with any one other than a bona fide partner if not wearing a condom. That bit of useless information came from an interview here on the ABC, our version of Aunty beeb.

j.sabourn
21st August 2012, 08:30 AM
A letter from the general public in todays paper The West Australian.
Julian Assange was very eager to want people and countries to answer to his so called Wikileaks but when it comes to the reverse he cries foul and looks for sanctuary to avoid standing up to his own so called system of truth.
I am pleased to know that other members of the public are not taken in by all this propoganda put out by his followers. Cheers John Sabourn

Captain Kong
21st August 2012, 10:10 AM
When I was on the ESSO VLCCs in the 70s and 80s world wide, we always sent our position to an American organisation, I forget the name now, maybe someone knows, AMVER.... something.
Cheers
Brian.

j.sabourn
21st August 2012, 10:28 AM
Thats the one Brian, forget also American something Voluntary something Routing. Cheers John Sabourn

Ron B Manderson
21st August 2012, 03:33 PM
If I was abetting man I would lay money on it .
If he is sent to Sweden he will be sent to USA. ASAP.
On american TV they agree with my thinking.
And as I said before "what about the human rights of the young soldier held without trial for 800 days. in a small cell alone.
The public in the usa are now wanting him freed. Will he be freed "no chance."
I have lived in the usa and they believe everything that the goverment tells them.Outside of their own state does not exsist.
The people in usa do not believe that there is camps in Cuba. Where there is people jailed without trial. Ah that never happened it was just other countrys picking on us.
We are loved all over the world. Get real !!
Bets will be taken.
I was once told by a lawyer in the states that IRA bombs never hurt children. Smart bombs then.I told him to go visit warrington and say that.
Ron the batcave

Ron B Manderson
21st August 2012, 03:39 PM
When I was on the ESSO VLCCs in the 70s and 80s world wide, we always sent our position to an American organisation, I forget the name now, maybe someone knows, AMVER.... something.
Cheers
Brian.
Thats ok Brian .
But in port and asked for all that info about the dock.
I know it was because a load of Russian engineers were there.
In Berbara the old man asked me to run a film (walport) for the russians.
I was in the bad books because I was showing " FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE". Funny the guest never arrivied.
Ron the batcave

John Albert Evans
21st August 2012, 04:42 PM
I understand that someone is offering a reward of 6500.00p for someone to set of the FIRE ALARM in the Ecuador Embassy.:clapping2:

Let the fun and games begin:xrofl:

JAE

Ron B Manderson
21st August 2012, 07:00 PM
As I have said before.
Lets all wait for the truth of the matter.
If he was a bad boy in Sweden jail him.
But to me it's all rumoers.
I just want the truth behind the whole thing.
Then I will make up my mind.
I don't think we will ever get that.
Until that I will keep my mind open.
Ron the batcave

j.sabourn
21st August 2012, 11:17 PM
Ron the only thing I can gather from the rumours via the press is that the 2 females accusing him are 2 employees of Wikileaks. Their names have not been given, but this is normal prior to any rape or attempted rape charges. Cheers John Sabourn.

John Pruden
22nd August 2012, 05:54 AM
the only thing the USA want him for is to keep what he knows out of the Internet? he must know were all the body's are buried and i think they know that.and now they can trump up any charge they want but he will Finnish up in the states like it or not the all powerful dollar will see to that politics is a dirty business. jp

Ron B Manderson
22nd August 2012, 05:58 AM
exact my point.
Dirty business
Ron the batcave

happy daze john in oz
22nd August 2012, 06:07 AM
!!

I was once told by a lawyer in the states that IRA bombs never hurt children. Smart bombs then.I told him to go visit warrington and say that.
Ron the batcave[/QUOTE]

Of course nott Ron, most of the munitions used by the IRA came from the States.

happy daze john in oz
22nd August 2012, 06:10 AM
exact my point.
Dirty business
Ron the batcave

He is entitled to the presumption of innocence until proved otherwise. But by doing what he has hiding away it creates a scenario where people now doubt his claim of innocence.

John Albert Evans
22nd August 2012, 04:10 PM
Can anyone confirm that Mr Assange is trying to rent out half his room to Mr Nadir.:confused:

John Albert Evans

John Pruden
22nd August 2012, 05:01 PM
what ever happens he will end up in the states. the Americans are after what hasn't reached the Internet yet he knows to much?jp